Mathematic volume question

[studiojb]

I have two main vocal parts singing the same line, each at -6.
I also have one harmony track at -3
Everything is panned to center.

I want to raise the vocal mix, but keep the same proportions.

(I know I could send them to an aux input and raise that, but I'm looking for a mathematic solution)

Question: If I raise each main vocal to -3, do I raise the harmony to 0, or would I need to go to +3 (since there's only one harmony track)?

Thanks for feeding my insanity.

[albee1952]

There must be at least 4 ways to do this(according to.....me). One would be to show volume automation on all 3 tracks, advance past the end of the song, use the inverted bracket tool(smart tool in the upper part of the track) and raise the level by 3db for each track(after you click to grab the volume line, hold Ctrl to get the fine mode and watch the screen as it shows you exactly how much you are adjusting). Another would be to group the 3 tracks and adjust any one(the grouping should do it to all 3). Then there's the plugin route. Say you have EQ III or a compressor on each track. Just open the last plugin and adjust the output to +3 db, or insert the TRIM plugin last and add 3db. Have I confused you enough

[GregV]

Understanding the correlation between db and perceived volume is more than math... there are so many other things going on in a mix. And if you've got compression on the Master Bus, then it's going to be messing with your "math" in all kinds of crazy ways.

In live sound design, the rule of thumb is something like this: The smallest perceptible change in a PA system's output is 3db, which is created by doubling its wattage. (Which is why a 100watt Marshall amp seems only marginally louder than a 50watt Marshall amp)

Yet we all know, after many hours of mixing, that even +0.3db on a word in a vocal track will make it pop out much more!

I don't know if there is a "rule of thumb" in mixing since the harmonic content, spread across the entire frequency spectrum, interacts in such wild and unpredictable ways.
But great question!!

[Ben Jenssen]

Like Albee said, grouping the three tracks and moving the faders will tell you the answer. As mathematical values.

[studiojb]

I've recently realized that I worded my question crappily. I should have said something like this.

Lets assume I have no master compression on the song.
I really like the blend I have going on with two tracks:
One track is the rhythm guitar track, which is a stereo track of multiple guitars panned LRC, and the second track is mono lead vocal track panned up the center.

To keep the same blend but raise the level, would I need to raise the mono track double what the stereo track would be? In other words if I raise the stereo track +3 on the PT fader, would I need to raise the mono track +6 to keep the same ratio?

Or would they both just be +3?

[crizdee]

Originally Posted by studiojb

I've recently realized that I worded my question crappily. I should have said something like this.

Lets assume I have no master compression on the song.
I really like the blend I have going on with two tracks:
One track is the rhythm guitar track, which is a stereo track of multiple guitars panned LRC, and the second track is mono lead vocal track panned up the center.

To keep the same blend but raise the level, would I need to raise the mono track double what the stereo track would be? In other words if I raise the stereo track +3 on the PT fader, would I need to raise the mono track +6 to keep the same ratio?

Or would they both just be +3?

Hi,

They can all move the same identical amount. As long as you don't change their pan position, it will stay true.


Chris