You guys helped once, please help again: swirling noise

[Obsidian Dragon]

I'm no expert when it comes to the Eleven Rack but I had a similar issue a few years ago with another modeling guitar amp. I also heard a swirling sound that seemed to ride on top of the guitar sound. It was there anytime a signal was present but not there when the signal was muted. It acted almost as if a gate shut it off when there was no signal but as soon as a signal came through, the swirling was there again. Here is what work for me in that case. I was using a standard power strip. I replace it with a Furman power conditioner and it got better but was not completely gone. I replaced that with a Monster power conditioner and that worked. The swirling was gone as far as I could hear. My guess is that the power conditions in my house had some noise from some appliance or other device that was injecting this noise into the line. The power conditioner was able to clean that up. I don't know if this will work in your case but it is worth a try.

[Benoni]

FWIW this "issue" has been mentioned before and discussed quiet thoroughly, even Chimp and Chris chimed in. The result was, the issue could not be replicated by Avid.

You can check out that thread here:
http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=297502

It's also important to note that some amps, the real amps, have ghost notes, and the Eleven Rack models stay true to the actual amp(s).

One person that said they could hear an exaggerated swirling installed Firmware 1.0.3 over 2.0, then re-installed 2.0 over 1.0.3 and said that the swirling was then less. However, if you read the tests that Chris did, samples from 1.0.3 and 2.0 both nulled, so they are the same.

Its important for me to mention that at that time, no 11R's were shipping with the ERXP pre-installed. The ERXP was purchases for $99. So if you have an 11R that had the ERXP PRE-Installed, and you install 1.0.3 over it, YOU WILL LOSE ACCESS TO ALL AMPS,EFFECTS,CABS,MICs ect... that were added by the ERXP.

If your 11R came PRE-INSTALLED with 2.0.1, and you install an older firmware over it, and then want to go back to 2.0.1, you will have to purchase the ERXP, or call Avid and see if they will show mercy on you and provide you with the needed SN and ID codes.

Originally Posted by 11R Newbie

jon9,

It sounds like you and I are talking about the exact same thing. If I play a rhythmic riff where the chords don't ring I don't really hear the swirl (or at least not as much) but if I strum a chord for a measure or two or hit a chord and then let it ring I hear the swirl.

Originally Posted by jon9

Yes, especially on single sustained notes, unusable. But it's like on top of the sound, like I said, a ghosting. Not part of the sound it's like an unnecessary addition to it, that ruins it. If it weren't for that i probably would use it for most of my tracking. It is also pretty noisy in higher gain settings and shutting that down with the gate really clamps any dynamics. If it were my marshall, I'd change the filter caps. Help!

Can both of you please post samples of what you are talking about?

Also please save the rig you use for the sample to your computer, and upload that as well so we can all try it and see if we can replicate it on our systems.

There are several free sites where you can upload the sample(s) to, like,
SoundCloud.com, Box.net, Mediafire, Dropbox, ect....

Thanks

[Benoni]

Originally Posted by Obsidian Dragon

I'm no expert when it comes to the Eleven Rack but I had a similar issue a few years ago with another modeling guitar amp. I also heard a swirling sound that seemed to ride on top of the guitar sound. It was there anytime a signal was present but not there when the signal was muted. It acted almost as if a gate shut it off when there was no signal but as soon as a signal came through, the swirling was there again. Here is what work for me in that case. I was using a standard power strip. I replace it with a Furman power conditioner and it got better but was not completely gone. I replaced that with a Monster power conditioner and that worked. The swirling was gone as far as I could hear. My guess is that the power conditions in my house had some noise from some appliance or other device that was injecting this noise into the line. The power conditioner was able to clean that up. I don't know if this will work in your case but it is worth a try.

That's a great tip dude

[jon9]

Originally Posted by Benoni

I assume you are talking to me. It is just a fact that there will be fizz in every distorted tone. However, if you feel you have evidence that says otherwise, please post it.

If you have "zero fizz" on your mic'ed amp, please post a short 10 -20 sec. sample on soundcloud, box.net, or the like. Dial in a heavy distorted tone suitable for metal, and play. Nothing fancy, just some open power chords will do fine. Then if there is any fizz (which there will be) I'll tell you exactly the frequency range(s) that I can hear it in.

Thanks.

I'm not challenging your "Fizz" detection. We probably just have a different definition of it. I'm talking about the sound that comes from modeled guitar sounds and simulators and this additional ghost sound that seems to ride over top of the sound. I've experienced it with the line 6 product, amplitube, riffworks and now ElevenRack. ElevenRack seems to have a little more @ the end and on sustained notes and chords and it kind of seems to swirl or phase. I'm saying this does not happen when I mic up my Marshall or Fargen amp. Sure there is gonna be more of a "fizzy" or "fake" sound when you use ultra high gain with anything. But I'm just wondering what's causing this "extra" bit in Eleven rack. I'm not trying to do anything but solve this issue I am having. I've only had the Eleven rack for about 2 months.

[Benoni]

Originally Posted by jon9

I'm not challenging your "Fizz" detection. We probably just have a different definition of it......

....I'm not trying to do anything but solve this issue I am having. I've only had the Eleven rack for about 2 months.

That's exactly why I am asking you for a sample, so we don't have to worry about defining what each of us means by "fizz". With an audio sample we can all hear what is going on and help nail down what exactly 'could' be happening with your Eleven Rack.

It will be so much easier for everyone to help you if you post a sample so we can listen to it on our systems and try out the rig setting on our systems, instead of trying to interpret what you mean by 'swirl' - if it is completely unusable as you say, then we should all be able to hear it pretty readily, and maybe be able to offer some solution.

[jon9]

I will when I get a chance.

[Benoni]

Originally Posted by jon9

I will when I get a chance.

Have you had a chance to record a short 20 -30 sec track yet so we can hear the swirl you speak of? it doesnt have to be fancy, just straight fifths will be fine.

[jon9]

Originally Posted by Benoni

Have you had a chance to record a short 20 -30 sec track yet so we can hear the swirl you speak of? it doesnt have to be fancy, just straight fifths will be fine.

Ok I just did. How do I post a .mp3 here? Also, saved the eleven rack settings but also no way to post them here either. I'll email them if someone would like me to.

[necjamc]

Originally Posted by jon9

Ok I just did. How do I post a .mp3 here? Also, saved the eleven rack settings but also no way to post them here either. I'll email them if someone would like me to.

You can upload it to soundcloud or any number of other free sites.

Originally Posted by Benoni

There are several free sites where you can upload the sample(s) to, like,
SoundCloud.com, Box.net, Mediafire, Dropbox, ect....

[jon9]

Here you are. It is single notes. You should be able to hear the ghost fizz and slight swirl. 3 settings were used with 2 amps mods. the RB-01b red and Plexiglass.
The guitar is a 50th Anniversary 1960 custom shop Les Paul ver.2

http://soundcloud.com/jon9/swirltest