S6 furniture

[Emcha_audio]

Oh im perfectly aware of that. Its just how you were saying your desk had q boominess at around 800 mad3 me think thqt you could be hqving the same problem I once had :)

[musicman691]

Originally Posted by Brandonx1

Isolated concrete slab. It s a well known fact desk's cause comb filtering. I'm not just discovering this and it's not a hidden secret. Any acoustision will tell you this and if you've ever had one at your spot to tune your room you would know just how bad desks are. Look at mastering rooms. Smallest desk possible.

But what about all those control rooms with HUGE consoles like the big SSL 9K's, Neves, etc? There's one large flat surface right in front of the operator. If it's a well known fact desk's cause comb filtering how come no one has talked about it in the past? You never here all the old guys go on about this.

None of the people who run acoustic treatment companies go on about consoles either. Ever hear the people at RealTraps, Auralex or even Russ Berger Design Group mention this in their materials? Nope.

[Stereo Missile]

Originally Posted by musicman691

But what about all those control rooms with HUGE consoles like the big SSL 9K's, Neves, etc? There's one large flat surface right in front of the operator. If it's a well known fact desk's cause comb filtering how come no one has talked about it in the past? You never here all the old guys go on about this.

None of the people who run acoustic treatment companies go on about consoles either. Ever hear the people at RealTraps, Auralex or even Russ Berger Design Group mention this in their materials? Nope.

That is actually precisely the reason that a lot of engineers want to get away from large format consoles. The fact is that they do cause acoustic issues. You will notice that most consoles have a tilt towards the operator, both for ergonomics and also to slightly reduce the effects of comb filtering. Also the knobs etc provide a small amount of diffusion. A flat desk surface however, which is reflecting sound from near field monitors directly to your ears causes the most problems.

Think of it in the same way that you would apply absorbers or diffusers to your walls - if you imagine that each surface is a mirror, if you could see your monitors reflected in that mirror then it is going to cause comb filtering of some sort because the reflected sound arrives out of phase with the direct sound from your monitors. This causes phase cancellation at a fundamental frequency and all of the upper harmonics of that frequency, thus creating a comb filter. The frequency of the comb filter changes as you move around, because the relative distance between the direct and reflected sound changes depending on your listening position.

[YYR123]

Cancel the 32 channel portico it's gonna cause comb filtering.......

.......said no one ever !

[Brandonx1]

The great thing about the s6 and the artist series is it's super compact and small you can have it on a super small frame. As long as you don't surround it with a big flat desk, you can minimize acoustic issues. A modern approach. Like I said I like the desk. Work man ship is obviously great. I personally would never have such a thing in my control room. Lobby maybe.

[Stereo Missile]

Originally Posted by YYR123

Cancel the 32 channel portico it's gonna cause comb filtering.......

.......said no one ever !

Of course not! It's a Neve so it must sound better right?

You know in the ideal control room we would have perfectly flat monitors and we would be suspended in space in a room with no walls or furniture to cause these pesky acoustic problems!

Back here in the real world of course, it helps to be aware of the acoustic issues we all have to deal with in real, imperfect spaces.

:)

[Drew Mazurek]

Originally Posted by Brandonx1

I personally would never have such a thing in my control room. Lobby maybe.

Again, almost all of the flat space you see will be covered with keyboards, gear, etc.

[musicman691]

Originally Posted by Drew Mazurek

Again, almost all of the flat space you see will be covered with keyboards, gear, etc.

Exactly. I think certain people here are committing something a title from a Shakeapeare play says: 'Much Ado About Nothing'. They think the flat surfaces will stay unused for stuff. As is well known nature abhors a vacuum (or flat surface).

It's just like listening to a track in isolation and then in a session - it may sound like crud solo'd but with other stuff around it it sounds just perfect. But then again I guess some people work in studios that Martha Stewart would be proud to own .

[Brandonx1]

Originally Posted by musicman691

Exactly. I think certain people here are committing something a title from a Shakeapeare play says: 'Much Ado About Nothing'. They think the flat surfaces will stay unused for stuff. As is well known nature abhors a vacuum (or flat surface).

It's just like listening to a track in isolation and then in a session - it may sound like crud solo'd but with other stuff around it it sounds just perfect. But then again I guess some people work in studios that Martha Stewart would be proud to own .

I disagree. I've worked in a ton of professional room, built my own room, 3 times now, and work with acousticians on all of them. The desk in front of you is a huge issue. Why do people spend 6k on monitors and nothing on acoustic design? Also, keyboards, gear only defuses down to 1/4 wavelength of the depth. So, if you have a piece of gear with knobs on it, it's not defusing anything of substance. You have getting the full comb filtering effect. A keyboard on the desk that's 4 inches high might be working to defuse to 5k at the lowest. You are still not going to be able to hear accurately in the mid range. Just something to think about.

[musicman691]

Originally Posted by Brandonx1

I disagree. I've worked in a ton of professional room, built my own room, 3 times now, and work with acousticians on all of them. The desk in front of you is a huge issue. Why do people spend 6k on monitors and nothing on acoustic design? Also, keyboards, gear only defuses down to 1/4 wavelength of the depth. So, if you have a piece of gear with knobs on it, it's not defusing anything of substance. You have getting the full comb filtering effect. A keyboard on the desk that's 4 inches high might be working to defuse to 5k at the lowest. You are still not going to be able to hear accurately in the mid range. Just something to think about.

Then we'll just have to agree to disagree then. Effectively you're saying that decades of practice by countless recording engineers has had issues then as regards layout and consoles used - I find that hard to believe. If you have proper placement of monitors then you won't get comb filtering from any surface in front of you.