I am getting "H/W Buffer" errors, but I have lots of power???

[Monaco]

I've been getting "H/W Buffer" errors and I don't know why. I have everything set up to Pro Tools specifications (don't connect to the internet, use BlueTooth, have indexing disabled etc...). Do my Playback Engine settings look right? Is my sample rate too high?

MY SETUP:

• Mac Pro "Eight-Core" 2.8Ghz (2008)
• 32GB RAM
• Pro Pools LE 8.0.5
• OSX 10.6
  Digi 002 Console

[Darryl Ramm]

What exact DAE errors are you getting?

When did this start happening? What changed just before that?

Does this only happen in some sessions? With some plugins being instantiated?

Start with NCPU=7 and 99% (leaves one free CPU for Pro Tools). Leave ignore errors unchecked as you have it.

Double check all optimizations (e.g. blue tooth should be off). Make sure every last thing is done while debugging.

What disk drive(s) are you using (make/model/spec and how are they connected) for a dedicated session/audio drive?

Do all the usual trouble shooting steps especially trashing databases and prefs, and tryign other sessions/starting with new/empty sessions (not copies, not templates) and trying to find any problematic plugins (by removing temp. moving out all third party RTAS plugins from their folder). All under the "help us help you" link up top of this page. Watch out for plugin denormalization problems (esp. with plugins like Sansamp), stick a dither plugin in front of any suspects to stop them chewing CPU.

Many of these problems with surprisingly high CPU load are caused by bad/problematic plugins, or if it happens suddenly without other changes by corrupt sessions. Of course without knowing in detail what your session looks like maybe you actually have a realistic CPU load for some extreme workload you are trying to run.

[Monaco]

Mr. Ramm, thank you for responding to my inquiry. This has been a massive headache.

Originally Posted by Darryl Ramm

What exact DAE errors are you getting? I don't know exactly, but it specifically tells me to increase the H/W buffer or remove some plug-ins.


When did this start happening? What changed just before that? It has always been this way.

Does this only happen in some sessions? With some plugins being instantiated? It happens when I use Battery 3, so I stopped using it. Now it's less frequent but still happens.

Start with NCPU=7 and 99% (leaves one free CPU for Pro Tools). Leave ignore errors unchecked as you have it. OK

Double check all optimizations (e.g. blue tooth should be off). Make sure every last thing is done while debugging. Done.

What disk drive(s) are you using (make/model/spec and how are they connected) for a dedicated session/audio drive?

Bay 1: Macintosh HD: Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 500GB ST3500630AS
Bay 2: Audio Drive: 3TB WD30EZRX
Bay 3: Samples: 2TB Hitachi GST Deskstar HDS723020BLA642
Bay 4: Backup: 3TB Seagate Barracuda ST3000DM001-1E6166

Do you think an SSD drive for my main drive would speed it up?

[Ben Jenssen]

Why do you use 96k sample rate?
If you don't have good reason, there's no need for more than 48k sample rate on your sessions. Double amount of data going thru isn't helping.
I found that PT on OSX 10.6 ran much better when limiting the number of prosessors in prefs. I keep my 2008 mac pro set to use just 2 of the 4 total cores for pro tools. 3 is also good, but 2 is even better. more stable.

[Darryl Ramm]

Bay 2: Audio Drive: 3TB WD30EZRX

Bzzzt. Those WDC Caviar Green drives, and their funky spin down and other power saving stupidity, are toxic to Pro Tools, and it is possible (but not guaranteed) this explains part of your problems. Either way you absolutely should get rid of that drive.

I would only replace that with a SSD drive, my preference would be a Samsung 850 Pro but Micron and SanDisk make nice SSDs as well (but be careful what models you get, ask here again if you can't find a 850 Pro). I would not get anything smaller than a 256 GB drive (some drive model performance varies significant with drive size).

get the drive, check the firmware is up to date (on Samsung's support web site), and when you format the drive I would leave about 13% or so free space (create two partitions, delete the small one to leave that ~13% space), that adds to the 7% factory default over provisioning and just gives a large pool of available unused pages for the drive to use to run more efficiently and replace work pages with over time. Find the Citori Trim enabler tool and install that and enable Trim on that drive.

The problem with your Mac Pro and IO is that it only supports SATA II (3 Gbps) on the motherboard, not SATA III (6 Gbps)? You can get an add-in PCIe to SATA III card but that is not necessary now, just get rid of that awful WDC Caviar Green drive. iI you need a low-cost HDD the WDC Caviar Black is a great drive, totally different from the problematic WDC Caviar Green.

[Darryl Ramm]

It happens when I use Battery 3, so I stopped using it. Now it's less frequent but still happens.

You need to check all your plugins are up to date and then systematically remove all third party plugin files from the plugin folder and put them back one (or one vendor) at a time and try to identify what ones if any are causing problems. You have to do this, even plugins that are installed but not instantiated can cause CPU problems.

You also need to look for denormalization problems, where plugins (esp. Sansamp) when instantiated will can CPU spikes/burn lots of CPU when the input signal signal is low. Fix this by not using those plugins or putting a dither plugin in front of them. Some reverb plugins are also notorious for his problem.

[Monaco]

Originally Posted by Darryl Ramm

Bzzzt. Those WDC Caviar Green drives, and their funky spin down and other power saving stupidity, are toxic to Pro Tools, and it is possible (but not guaranteed) this explains part of your problems. Either way you absolutely should get rid of that drive.

I would only replace that with a SSD drive

Is having a faster audio drive more important than having a faster OS drive?

What if I switched the 3TB Seagate for and used the Caviar as my backup?

[Southsidemusic]

Originally Posted by Monaco

Is having a faster audio drive more important than having a faster OS drive?

What if I switched the 3TB Seagate for and used the Caviar as my backup?

If you want to be able to run PT without troubbleshooting and errors atopping the workflow you NEED to scrap the Green drive for good. It won't work in any instance of Audio for PT so swapping it with the other drive and still use it is the same as driving a Ferrari with the handbrake on and that won't do right

Just invest in 2 new WDC BLACK drives of 1-3 TB each and be done with it. You will spend about 140-150 dollars and not having to worry anymore.

As far as I can see all those drives listed in your sig are older models and the WDC Black drives are 9ms seek time which is great and they are loaded with 64MB cache which makes then much faster and much more useful with DAW's and PT in particular,

I am always stunned to see members posting that their Computers and slow drives runs great with "other" DAW's but in order to run Pro Tools which is a pretty taxing DAW on CPU and drive specific you need to have the correct hardware. I am not pointing at you here, just an observation for others who might read this and wonder why their system is problematic,

I say drop the drives and get two new ines and start over from scratch.

The Green WD Drive is maybe capable of using as a Backup but I wouldn't trust that drive with anything audio or anything really so think about this and make a decision upon said info.

[Darryl Ramm]

Originally Posted by Monaco

Is having a faster audio drive more important than having a faster OS drive?

What if I switched the 3TB Seagate for and used the Caviar as my backup?

You are asking to compare two different things.

System drive affects boot time, app start up time, VI startup if samples are there, VI streaming if streaming VI samples are there, and overall snappiness/feel of the system.

A substandard audio drive like the utter piece of crap drive you have can just kill Pro Tools, CPU errors, IO errors, random bad things.

Those green drives are barely OK as backup drives (slow sequential IO). I would open a nearby window and throw it as far as you can out that window (after you have cloned the drive). Why risk even screwing around with your backup. Leave it where it is. Change one thing at a time. Just go get a good new drive. WD Black or better a good SSD. A new drive is cheap, certainly compared to accidentally breaking a system.

[Monaco]

Well, I'm going to buy an SSD and a WDC black, but I'm trying to determine if the SSD would be better used as an audio drive or as my main drive.