Avid Pro Audio Community

Bob Olhsson · #**111** 12-10-2016, 08:51 AM

Now it's time to start listing specific bugs on ideascale and commenting on/voting up any bugs you've also seen so they can isolate causes and set priorities!

I don't think any developer knowingly releases buggy versions. They can't fix what they don't know about. They also can't fix something if it would break other things before they replace an entire underlying section of code.

amagras · #**112** 12-10-2016, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson

Now it's time to start listing specific bugs on ideascale and commenting on/voting up any bugs you've also seen so they can isolate causes and set priorities!

I don't think any developer knowingly releases buggy versions. They can't fix what they don't know about. They also can't fix something if it would break other things before they replace an entire underlying section of code.

Just thinking out loud... Would you say it's a good idea to list all the bugs (or the links to other ideascale bug reports) in the comment section of this Idea so it grows faster and become a comprehensive list of the bugs for the devs?

Here's the link again
http://protools.ideascale.com/a/dtd/...2!/257350-3779

noiseboyuk · #**113** 12-10-2016, 09:32 AM

D'ya know - I frequent the DUC here and the Sternberg forum for Cubase. Most posts are literally interchangeable.

Bob Olhsson · #**114** 12-10-2016, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amagras

Just thinking out loud... Would you say it's a good idea to list all the bugs (or the links to other ideascale bug reports)...

Thinking out loud, if you don't care enough to vote up bugs you've seen and write up bugs that are new to ideascale, why should Avid care enough to fix bugs that seem to be only bothering you?

amagras · #**115** 12-10-2016, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson

bugs that seem to be only bothering you?

With all due respect Bob, to say that is like not wanting to see things

dterry · #**116** 12-10-2016, 10:43 AM

Only in the audio industry are bugs fixes determined by popular opinion.

In the tech world, you fix anything you can because you can't afford to wait until your biggest clients find a bug and drop you for a competitor.

29CountsNY · #**117** 12-10-2016, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by noiseboyuk

D'ya know - I frequent the DUC here and the Sternberg forum for Cubase. Most posts are literally interchangeable.

Yep!
Have been checking out their forum with the rollout of Cubase 9 and it is like deja vu!
The grass isn't always greener on the other side.

Bob Olhsson · #**118** 12-10-2016, 12:45 PM

DAW software is among the most complex with the greatest backward compatibility requirements. This is due to its being real time interactive software for working on projects whose financial value vastly exceeds that of the software.

When you've got more bugs to fix than time to fix them, why not let user opinion help decide what to fix first? I realize everybody wants it all now...

dterry · #**119** 12-10-2016, 01:33 PM

Bob, complexity isn't the main reason - just a lesser contributing factor.

I've watched very simple bugs, that development teams have confirmed, go unaddressed for years, literally (not just Avid), and not due to complexity. In some cases, they just weren't popular requests, or even if they were, the company either deemed them not worth the time or just never found time to schedule them (bumped off the list release after release). Development team size sometimes also plays a role - a company may have to prioritize allocating engineers to fixing bugs vs. developing features or products.

But the main driving force is always income generators: new features and new products. These two sell upgrades (support plans in Avid's case) and get new customers. Whatever is left over from that income after core and new feature development expenses (that isn't allocated to other departments/business needs), might be allocated to fixing bugs. Time and scheduling also play a role there - there is time allocated to fixing bugs, but the release schedules are often mostly set in stone. Bug fixes that aren't finished by release are bumped to the next based on internal prioritization, and they may get bumped many times. I know that is the case from personal experience. That's just the reality of development in a niche market like pro audio.

I know where you are coming from - there is no value in pointing fingers at Avid, or complaining needlessly on forums where it isn't possible or productive for Avid (or other companies) to attempt to compile reports. But absent of a public bug database, unfortunately, sometimes the only way to get some issues addressed is for users to make enough noise to be heard. That is far from ideal for sure though. I hope Avid figures out a way around this.

I've talked with Avid support several times, and have been impressed with their desire to help, professionalism, and courtesy - they have a lot on their plates. I think they have tried with the IdeaScale and now with ACA - with thousands of customers, reports and requests, it just isn't an easy task no matter how it is handled. Personally, I try to find workarounds and move on. I know there is no way they are going to allocate a day or two of an engineer's time to find a bug if I'm the only one reporting it.

Ianduarte · #**120** 12-10-2016, 03:18 PM

Isn't it what the Crash Reporter is supposed to do?
Shouldn't it report to Avid the Pro Tools Crashes as they happen so that Avid can fix them?
I really think that it could create a log with the cause of the crash so that we could fix somethings by ourselves. If somehow a plugin caused the crash, simply remove it from the session wile it is broken and causing crashes, and than complain with the manufacturer, instead of blaming Pro tools.

Just my 2 cents.