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  #1  
Old 09-08-2008, 02:02 PM
Xavior Xavior is offline
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Default Question about "Groups"

I've created several groups ..but when I "mute" one of the groups (by pressing a single mute button of any track within the group), one or more of the tracks in the group will not stay muted during playback.
I've noticed that the tracks (within the group) that do this are tracks that I have previously applied a "write" of "mute automation" to prior.
Anyone know how I keep these tracks muted in "group" during playback.
They seem to still be following their "mute" automation.

Thanks Xavior
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  #2  
Old 09-08-2008, 05:20 PM
Xavior Xavior is offline
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Default Re: Question about "Groups"

Follow up to my previous question:

I know that I can turn off the Automation to a single track during playback (change automation mode from Read to off) and this seems to work in "Group" mute mode to keep the track from following it's "mute" automation and just remain muted, but when you have several tracks with "mute" automation applied it's real easy to forget to turn one back on ........ is their an alternate way to accomplish the same thing here ??
I hope what I'm saying is making sence.

Thanks
Xavior
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  #3  
Old 09-08-2008, 05:35 PM
DJ Hellfire DJ Hellfire is offline
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Default Re: Question about "Groups"

This happens when you "write" automation. I believe in the window menu, you can go down to automation and select which automation modes are activated in write mode. If you deselect mute, the mutes will not get written when you write an automation and your mutes will stay where you want them throughout the entire track. I find it's always best to just pencil in automation instead of writing it. That way you can put break points exactly where you want and it only automates the option you select. Hope this helps.
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  #4  
Old 09-09-2008, 12:12 AM
Xavior Xavior is offline
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Default Re: Question about "Groups" and "Mute" and "Automation" and Life (I need to get one)

I see what your saying and yes the "pencil tool" is definately the way to go, because no matter how fast you are with a "click" (either mouse or ctl24 or whatever) it's extrememly hard to get (intricate) mutes right on the beat. By selecting "mute" in the TRACK DISPLAY and using the pencil tool (and grabber if needed) you can line up your mutes exactly to the beat and only "write mute" to that exact point and see a visual overlay of all your mute points... Pretty cool.

The item I've been dealing with is :

When a track (lets say VIOLIN) has "mute automation" on it of any kind, (written, pencil etc.) and you have said track in a regions "group" with other tracks (using the create group function) ......lets say you call this group of tracks "STRINGS". When you mute group "STRINGS" by pressing any mute button on any of the "STRINGS" tracks located in the group, the track which contains "mute" automation (VIOLIN in this case) will still cycle itself (during playback) to follow the mute automation written to the track regardless of the master "mute" status of the group.
So although all the other tracks of the group called "STRINGS" stay muted, during playback, the track "VIOLIN" continues to turn on and off and follow it's original "mute automation" commands, basically...playng.


This tells me that "mute automation" on a track "overides" group mute commands.


I was just wondering if there was any way to reverse that situation so that "group mute" commands..overides any individual "track mute automation".


The fix I have right now is to turn off any automation on the track by selecting "off" in the automation window of the track before setting the group to "mute".
This is all well and good if your talking about one track, but when you have several tracks in different groups with the same mute automation situation as the track called "VIOLIN", it can get tricky because you have to remember to turn automation back on, each and every time you finish muting a group....and it really slows down the workflow.

phew......sorry about the long post.

Xavior
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  #5  
Old 09-09-2008, 11:40 AM
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DigiTechSupt DigiTechSupt is offline
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Default Re: Question about "Groups" and "Mute" and "Automation" and Life (I need to get one)

Quote:
This tells me that "mute automation" on a track "overides" group mute commands.
That is correct.

Quote:
I was just wondering if there was any way to reverse that situation so that "group mute" commands..overides any individual "track mute automation".
Suspend automation on those tracks/group.
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  #6  
Old 09-09-2008, 01:50 PM
Xavior Xavior is offline
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Default Re: Question about "Groups" and "Mute" and "Automation" and Life (I need to get one)

Quote:
Originally Posted by DigiTechSupt View Post
That is correct.



Suspend automation on those tracks/group.

Thanks for the reply DigiTechSupt ..... that will work.

It's a minor issue but I'm just wondering why the "group mute mode" does not override any "track mute automation".
I'm having a hard time thinking of an instance where you would want "track mute automation" to continue to run while the group was in a "mute" state. However, I'm still learning and perhaps it is best the way it is.

The more I learn ...the more I realize how much more there is to Know.
Thanks again
Xavior
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Old 09-15-2008, 05:42 PM
BaileyBass BaileyBass is offline
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Default Re: Question about "Groups" and "Mute" and "Automation" and Life (I need to get one)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xavior View Post
Thanks for the reply DigiTechSupt ..... that will work.

It's a minor issue but I'm just wondering why the "group mute mode" does not override any "track mute automation".
I'm having a hard time thinking of an instance where you would want "track mute automation" to continue to run while the group was in a "mute" state. However, I'm still learning and perhaps it is best the way it is.

The more I learn ...the more I realize how much more there is to Know.
Thanks again
Xavior
A way to make what you need to happen would be to bus all those tracks to a stereo aux, (do not put it in the group) then set that aux output to the one that those tracks were sending to..... Do NOT write any automation to the aux, and when you mute that "group master" all the tracks are muted. This method of "sub mixing", when utilized properly can make mixing much simpler, and offer quite a few additional options. Also look into VCA masters which do everything you need as well.
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Old 09-15-2008, 06:42 PM
Xavior Xavior is offline
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Default Re: Question about "Groups" and "Mute" and "Automation" and Life (I need to get one)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BaileyBass View Post
A way to make what you need to happen would be to bus all those tracks to a stereo aux, (do not put it in the group) then set that aux output to the one that those tracks were sending to..... Do NOT write any automation to the aux, and when you mute that "group master" all the tracks are muted. This method of "sub mixing", when utilized properly can make mixing much simpler, and offer quite a few additional options. Also look into VCA masters which do everything you need as well.
Thanks BaileyBass ...that makes a lot sense.
Xavior
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