Grand Piano for Recording, Help !

[edwarden]

I am planing to set up a new studio using Protools system ( Apogee, Waves L2, Avalon, Focusrite, Tubetec...Mic-pre & Dynamics. )
The Recording booth will be 10W x 5D x 5.25H Metre. Mostly for crossover projects with strings, percussions, Drums and of course MIDI stuff...,etc.

My question is to choose a good Grand Piano for this purpose. I am thinking of Yamaha C3, C5 or model/class above, Steinway.. would you mind suggesting me which brand and model will do most job ?
What kind of microphone I should use ? ( I know have to prepare many of them for vary cases. )

Thanks & Regards in advance !


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[juneaudio]

Ive always been happy with our Yamaha C-7, miked with Neumann KM84's or Royer 121's.

[edwarden]

Thanks ! Juneaudio !
Which pre-amp you use then ?
What kind of music you record/produce/processing mostly ? What's the equipment you use and how's the wiring thing going ? I'd like to acquire more knowledge from you if it's possible !

Again, Thanks for your speedy reply !



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[Bob Olhsson]

You need to shop around for a studio piano, no two are really alike. There are good and bad examples of every major brand.

It's important to make sure that repair parts will be easily available so I wouldn't stray from the biggest names. The main thing to understand is that really outstanding pianos are almost never sold at a discount and you need to be very skeptical about any "deals." Too many studios have "dog" pianos as a result of misguided penny-pinching.

Quality pianos also hold their value extremely well and appreciate over time as the prices of new pianos go up. For this reason it's pretty easy to get a lot of the cost of a decent piano financed.

[edwarden]

Dear Bob,
Your message are noted. Thanks ! Also, I will have one experienced AC Piano tech. person to go with me while choosing the Piano !

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[PDupre]

Definately shop around but I would stay away from Steinway. I have had a lot of luck with Beckstein and Bosendorfer. This is not entirely subjective. A well built piano will not only appreciate in value as mentioned above but will also have a lot less machanical noise(ie pedals, etc.). Good luck - Peter

[Didier de Roos]

I've had the dubious honour to record a horrible Bösendorfer a few years ago (leased for several days by the official Brussels dealer, would you believe it). There are some marvellous Steinways, but also terrible ones from a recording point of view, mainly depending on how the piano has been treated in the course of time (i.e. banged upon by music students).
The best piano I've recorded so far is a Fazioli: try and look those up.
One word of advice: don't try to cram a concert grand in too small a space, it almost certainly won't do it justice. I think the recording space you're planning to build, although by no means small, would work much better with a half-grand.
Microphones: try some B&Ks (DPA) 4006 or 4004, and put that through a Millenia preamp.

Only a few personal words of advice...

Didier

[edwarden]

Dear All,

Thanks for all of your comments ! More comments are welcome !

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[Baixo]

Interesting topic!

Piano recording is a potentially extremely complex affair, especially when the pianist is very involved in the regulation, action and voicing of pianos. I'd like to here from people who may have recorded Baldwins. How were they?

[Rich Breen]

Originally posted by edwarden:
...I am thinking of Yamaha C3, C5 or model/class above, Steinway.. would you mind suggesting me which brand and model will do most job ?
What kind of microphone I should use ?...

FWIW - Firstly, personal taste is extremely important here, so you'll have to do a fair amount of shopping on your own, and as others have stated, setup and maintenance are absolutely critical to the sound of the instrument - two of the same model piano can sound radically different depending on how they've been kept (and the tuning/voicing job done before every session), not to mention the fact that no two instruments ever sound the same. That said, the ubiquitous (and fairly reasonably priced) Yamaha C7 can sound lovely and there are some great ones around - I believe the newer C7IIFS (I'm not sure my numbers are exactly right?) has a slightly longer scale than previous models, and to my ear a more satisfying low end. I think you'll find the newer ones fairly consistent from the factory. The C7 would probably also be a good choice given the size of your room (a bit small for a 9-footer). Steinway B and D's are incredible instruments (a Steinway Hamburg 'D' can be a truly magnificent instrument if it's in good shape). I've never heard an instrument smaller than these three that has an acceptable low end for recording (the Steinway B is even a bit short in scale for my taste), so I would not bother with the C3 or C5 unless the higher priced models are absolutely out of the question.

The Fazioli is indeed wonderful, but also incredibly expensive and hard to get. I had always found Bosendorfers to be too agressive for my taste, but I recorded a new one a few months ago from David Abell that was absolutely gorgeous! Lovely, mellow character, and fabulous action. Still, you'll probably find them too pricey.

As far as mics go, again - you'll find as many opinions as engineers, but personally I'm a big fan of DPA4011s, Schoeps CMCs with a cardioid capsule, or Sennheiser MKH80s on piano - feed those to any good preamp (Hardy, Millenia, GML, etc..) and you can't go wrong.

Hope that helps,
Rich



[This message has been edited by Rich Breen (edited February 24, 2001).]