new pro tools is not as good

[Dizzi45Z]

Are you all sure about this? My understanding is that Logic is 32 bit floating point. Not 64 bit floating point. When I Google Logic 64 bit floating point, nothing relevant comes up. If I Google Logic 32 bit floating point, I get tons of relevant information. (Not that Google is the ultimate source LOL) But does anybody have any documentation that Logic is 64 Bit floating point?

[zion]

Originally Posted by C

THat's the white paper I was looking for. Thanks for reposting it.

No problem. It really explains the mechanics and how it works.

[zion]

Here is a white paper from Texas Instruments that gives some insight comparing fixed and floating point DSP. http://www.ti.com/lit/wp/spry061/spry061.pdf I found this helpful.

[mightyduck]

Originally Posted by Dizzi45Z

Are you all sure about this? My understanding is that Logic is 32 bit floating point. Not 64 bit floating point. When I Google Logic 64 bit floating point, nothing relevant comes up. If I Google Logic 32 bit floating point, I get tons of relevant information. (Not that Google is the ultimate source LOL) But does anybody have any documentation that Logic is 64 Bit floating point?

I think you may be conflating 64 it application with 64 bit audio. Its my understanding that, as of version 9, you can run the Logic application in some sort of 64 it modek. At least that's what's claimed. People that use a lot of virtual instruments are very into that because they can have access to extra RAM.

[mightyduck]

Originally Posted by zion

Here is a white paper from Texas Instruments that gives some insight comparing fixed and floating point DSP. http://www.ti.com/lit/wp/spry061/spry061.pdf I found this helpful.

I really just skimmed it, but its pretty obviously a sales tool. They are talking specifically about their chips. Are those TI chips being used in DAWs?

The Moorer paper [48-BIT INTEGER PROCESSING BEATS 32-BIT FLOATING. POINT FOR PROFESSIONAL AUDIO APPLICATIONS. -. James A. Moorer. Sonic Solutions.] someone uploaded earlier in the thread is the word on this stuff.

[mightyduck]

Originally Posted by Greg Malcangi

There maybe some people reading this thread who have not had the inclination or time to research digital audio theory in any great detail.

You mean like you?

For the benefit of all, I would like to add a warning to this thread! Mightyduck uses digital audio terminology well, which makes his statements appear educated and authoritative. However, some of his statements are at best misleading and at worst, absolutely incorrect.

That's both misleading and incorrect.

For example: The assumption that float cannot be dithered is simply wrong! Dithering signals that are aimed at fixed point conversions can be easily done in the float domain without problem.

You're wrong about that. You are also being misleading by trying to redefine the terms of the argument. We are not talking only about ""signals that are "aimed" at fixed point conversions"". Are we? And even those signals cannot be actually dithered because the damage is already done, and it is generally going to be written into the file way above the least significant bit. So how are you going to dither that? Are you going to try to use TPDF at some ridiculous level? No.

So those 24 bit fixed files, or 32 bit float files in your 32 bit float app. are going to have quantization error at various and sundry amplitudes. Unditherable.

I'm not sure whether Mightyduck is just mis-informed or is deliberately trying to mislead because he has an agenda? Not everything Mightyduck is saying is incorrect but there's enough inaccuracy to cause concern. My reason for this post is that there's enough misunderstanding of digital audio theory already, due to the fact that some of it is a little counter intuitive.

Yeah, right. You're reason for posting that is essentially a grudge, and the fact that what is being discussed here doesn't comport with what one particular "hero" of yours may have spun in some threads where he was defending his products.

Everyone who works with digital audio should have at least a passing understanding of the work of Nyquist, Shannon, Lip[bleep][bleep][bleep][bleep]z and Vanderkooy. Easy access to the work of these scientists can be had through the writings of: Paul Frindle, Bob Katz, Dan Lavry and Nika Aldrich (for example). Googling these names and reading what they've written online will cost you nothing (except time) and will give you as good an understanding of digital audio as you will ever need.

That's b.s.

[dave911]

http://thewelltemperedcomputer.com/L...tingdither.pdf

[Emcha_audio]

Originally Posted by mightyduck

I really just skimmed it, but its pretty obviously a sales tool. They are talking specifically about their chips. Are those TI chips being used in DAWs?

The Moorer paper [48-BIT INTEGER PROCESSING BEATS 32-BIT FLOATING. POINT FOR PROFESSIONAL AUDIO APPLICATIONS. -. James A. Moorer. Sonic Solutions.] someone uploaded earlier in the thread is the word on this stuff.

The chips in the tdm system were motorola 56 k series chips, the chips in the HDX system are TI chips.

[mightyduck]

Originally Posted by Emcha_audio

The chips in the tdm system were motorola 56 k series chips, the chips in the HDX system are TI chips.

Ha, ha. Are they, by any chance, the ones advertised in the white paper / promo sheet? : )

[mightyduck]

Originally Posted by Dizzi45Z

Are you all sure about this? My understanding is that Logic is 32 bit floating point. Not 64 bit floating point. When I Google Logic 64 bit floating point, nothing relevant comes up. If I Google Logic 32 bit floating point, I get tons of relevant information. (Not that Google is the ultimate source LOL) But does anybody have any documentation that Logic is 64 Bit floating point?

Here, I found this on their FAQ:

7. Q: How can I run Logic 9.1 as a 64 bit Application?

A: Right click on the application in Finder (or Command + i) to open the information window, in which there is a checkbox option to launch in 32 or 64-bit.It is set to 32 bit by default, uncheck to launch Logic 9.1 in 64 bit mode. Please note, some of the oldest Intel macs, such as the first core duo iMacs, Mac Minis, Mac Books and Mac Books Pro from 2006, cannot run 64 bit Apps, neither is this possible with the Core Solo Mac Mini. All Mac Pros and Core 2 Duo equipped Macs can run Logic 9.1 as a 64 bit Application.

http://www.logic-users-group.com/index.php?q=126.html