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  #1  
Old 03-07-2020, 10:54 PM
lgabor lgabor is offline
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Default Atmos and AVR

Hi Guys, i am extremely new on this forum and would greatly appreciate if you can point me in the right direction with my project. I am for experimental purposes would like to try out dolby atmos mixing for my travel videos. I understand that i have to use pro tools and dolby atmos production suite for this but i am very unclear on the hardware part. How do the sound travels from mixing in the softwares to the speakers. Out from my mac to a TB3 Ultrastudio and via HDMI to to an AVR and from there to the speakers will work for mixing dolby atmos ?
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  #2  
Old 03-08-2020, 01:05 AM
Frank Kruse Frank Kruse is offline
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Default Re: Atmos and AVR

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Originally Posted by lgabor View Post
Out from my mac to a TB3 Ultrastudio and via HDMI to to an AVR and from there to the speakers will work for mixing dolby atmos ?
I don't think hat will work. AVRs need an embedded/encoded transport stream like from a consumer end product (Apple TV / Blu Ray) to decode that. I don't think you can squeeze a discrete 7.1.4 signal through HDMI from the DAPS. The Ultrastudio only does stereo over HDMI (8 for the 4k Extreme but that's 7.1 maximum and It might max out at 5.1, not sure but you could re-render to 5.1 or 7.1 for monitoring which is probably pointless if you want to work in Atmos in the first place). You can try to de-embed the channels from the SDI out which does support 16 channels but that won't help unless your AVR has discrete inputs for 7.1.4 from external gear. AVRs are not really usable a monitor device they are made for consumers that monitor the encoded end product.

You need to monitor through the Dolby render unit and your audio interface and connect your speakers to that.

So it's PT -> DA production suite (via Dolby audio bridge) -> audio interface (set that in DAPS)

Quick demo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmRNxEKlD8c
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Last edited by Frank Kruse; 03-08-2020 at 01:46 AM.
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  #3  
Old 03-08-2020, 01:50 AM
lgabor lgabor is offline
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Default Re: Atmos and AVR

Thanks Frank..I do have SDi out with 16 channels but no idea how to connect that to any AVR...so can you pls give me a sample products which i required to get in order to built this ?

"So it's PT -> DA production suite (via Dolby audio bridge) -> audio interface (set that in DAPS)"

So protools to DA production suite is straightforward as it is software only. So what kind of hardware i need to get and do i need self powered speakers than as well ? Can you pls give me sample product details if you have the time , appreciate it.
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  #4  
Old 03-08-2020, 01:56 AM
Frank Kruse Frank Kruse is offline
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Default Re: Atmos and AVR

Do a search for SDI de-embedders. BM make a couple. Either to AES or analogue.

Once your signals are analogue you can patch them into any monitor controller or speakers you want. There are millions out there.

You could also ditch the BM Monitor and use Dante virtual sound card plus any Dante capable interface with at least 12 outs for 7.1.4. would be more elegant, less cross-conversions than going through SDI/AES/Analogue.

For example I use a Xilica Neutrino (has 16 analogue outs) which does monitor processing and Dante on the same ticket so it's your interface and monitor controller at the same time. The new FR1 is great as it's modular and you can tailor it to your needs. Or you use the new MTRX Studio.

Tons of options. But note that this kind of setup will set you back at least in the area of 5k$ or slightly below that plus speakers/amps.

F.
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  #5  
Old 03-08-2020, 06:15 AM
lgabor lgabor is offline
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Default Re: Atmos and AVR

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Kruse View Post
Do a search for SDI de-embedders. BM make a couple. Either to AES or analogue.

Once your signals are analogue you can patch them into any monitor controller or speakers you want. There are millions out there.

You could also ditch the BM Monitor and use Dante virtual sound card plus any Dante capable interface with at least 12 outs for 7.1.4. would be more elegant, less cross-conversions than going through SDI/AES/Analogue.

For example I use a Xilica Neutrino (has 16 analogue outs) which does monitor processing and Dante on the same ticket so it's your interface and monitor controller at the same time. The new FR1 is great as it's modular and you can tailor it to your needs. Or you use the new MTRX Studio.

Tons of options. But note that this kind of setup will set you back at least in the area of 5k$ or slightly below that plus speakers/amps.

F.
Thanks again Frank, since i am coming from the video world some of these things are not clear to me....
SDI deembedders from BM only gives 4 analog or 8 AES so that is not enough...or i missunderstand something.
Dante seems to make sense to me...i think...so dante is a virtual sound card i can download and use PT IO from dante and use a dante capable interface such as the Neutrino to connect to speakers ? What kind of speakers needed to that ? Self powered ?
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Old 03-08-2020, 06:31 AM
Frank Kruse Frank Kruse is offline
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Default Re: Atmos and AVR

Quote:
Originally Posted by lgabor View Post
Thanks again Frank, since i am coming from the video world some of these things are not clear to me....
SDI deembedders from BM only gives 4 analog or 8 AES so that is not enough...or i missunderstand something.
Dante seems to make sense to me...i think...so dante is a virtual sound card i can download and use PT IO from dante and use a dante capable interface such as the Neutrino to connect to speakers ? What kind of speakers needed to that ? Self powered ?
#1 Yeah, the SDI route is cumbersome and won't be great in the long run if you want to do this properly. It was just an idea based on what you have already.

#2 Yes the key is to get 12 channels (for 7.4.1) or more out of protools. That's not necessarily an Atmos thing. But you need to hear 12 channels, simple as that. So you could use any interface with 12 or more outs be it Dante, A stack of AVID interfaces or a Dante network into Dante amps. What I mentioned was just an example out of an ocean of options. It's just that your AVR won't do the trick because it's not made to integrate into a production situation.

#3 Speakers: Can be active or passive with amps or a combination. It all depends on room size, listening distance, mounting options, taste, required headroom for Dolby Atmos home specs and many other factors like budget. It's impossible to tell you the best solution on this platform. Way too many options to cover all that here, sorry.

Maybe you need a studio designer to have a look at your room first?
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Last edited by Frank Kruse; 03-08-2020 at 06:53 AM.
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  #7  
Old 03-23-2020, 06:03 AM
lgabor lgabor is offline
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Default Re: Atmos and AVR

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Kruse View Post
#1 Yeah, the SDI route is cumbersome and won't be great in the long run if you want to do this properly. It was just an idea based on what you have already.

#2 Yes the key is to get 12 channels (for 7.4.1) or more out of protools. That's not necessarily an Atmos thing. But you need to hear 12 channels, simple as that. So you could use any interface with 12 or more outs be it Dante, A stack of AVID interfaces or a Dante network into Dante amps. What I mentioned was just an example out of an ocean of options. It's just that your AVR won't do the trick because it's not made to integrate into a production situation.

#3 Speakers: Can be active or passive with amps or a combination. It all depends on room size, listening distance, mounting options, taste, required headroom for Dolby Atmos home specs and many other factors like budget. It's impossible to tell you the best solution on this platform. Way too many options to cover all that here, sorry.

Maybe you need a studio designer to have a look at your room first?
Hi Frank, I think i figured it out...so do you mind telling me if this setup will work:
PT with DAPS 12 channel out via DANTE via Focusrite Rednet 2. From there to 6x 2 channel amplifier and than to each passive speaker.
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  #8  
Old 03-23-2020, 06:46 AM
Frank Kruse Frank Kruse is offline
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Default Re: Atmos and AVR

Quote:
Originally Posted by lgabor View Post
Hi Frank, I think i figured it out...so do you mind telling me if this setup will work:
PT with DAPS 12 channel out via DANTE via Focusrite Rednet 2. From there to 6x 2 channel amplifier and than to each passive speaker.
Sure, whatever will offer 12 outs from your system will work.
That said you won't have any monitor control (volume or calibration) with that setup so (unless you want to dive into every single amplifier every time you want to change your levels) in the long run you might want to add a speaker controller but yes in principle 12 outs to 12 speakers will technically work as al absolute minimum setup.
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  #9  
Old 03-23-2020, 07:06 AM
lgabor lgabor is offline
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Default Re: Atmos and AVR

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Kruse View Post
Sure, whatever will offer 12 outs from your system will work.
That said you won't have any monitor control (volume or calibration) with that setup so (unless you want to dive into every single amplifier every time you want to change your levels) in the long run you might want to add a speaker controller but yes in principle 12 outs to 12 speakers will technically work as al absolute minimum setup.
Thank you for checking and confirming it back to me!!! Appreciate it.
Would you mind to give me a sample speaker controller product that will work for a better monitoring so i can research it more from this example you can give me?
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  #10  
Old 03-23-2020, 11:03 AM
Frank Kruse Frank Kruse is offline
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Default Re: Atmos and AVR

Xilica FR1, QSYS, BSS Soundweb, AVID'S MTRX and MTRX studio , the latter probably being the most cost efficient if you are starting from scratch. Not as modular and configurable as the open fully modular systems like the Xilica, QSYS, BSS but for simpler setups it has it all on board.

Not yet available though I think.

F.
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