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  #1  
Old 06-23-2004, 11:22 PM
Mt.Everest Mt.Everest is offline
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Default Why is track metering now so different?!?! arrgh!

Why does the track level meter now show whats ON disk regardless of the track being record enabled or not?!? I thought it was a great feature that Protools would show you INPUT metering on a track, all the time, when the track was record enabled. This would allow me to visually SEE that a singer was in fact singing along before a punch in, or see if they are telling me to stop playback when I cant actually hear them. Usually singers like the room dark and I can never see whats going on so I used the great Protools metering to visually cue me in to whats going on.

WHY is it now only showing the level of whats on DISK, even when record enabled in 6.4?!? Its driving me crazy! It was such a cool feature that you would SEE input but HEAR whats on disk in auto-input mode. I think they changed a good feature for no reason. Anyone else agree?

Not to mention that if I select INPUT ONLY globally, i still have to engage it on every new track that is record enabled. Why did Digidesign change the ability to select INPUT ONLY and LEAVE IT LIKE THAT UNTIL I TELL IT TO SWITCH?!? Arrgh! PT 6.4 is driving me nuts. Its killing major aspects of my work flow!

MT
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  #2  
Old 06-24-2004, 01:23 PM
KingFish KingFish is offline
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Default Re: Why is track metering now so different?!?! arrgh!

I've been keeping an eye out for a reply on this one too, I have noticed since 6.4, that the track meters will not represent your input, when you are monitoring input, during playback , on a rec enable track.

This is a glitch, or bad programming, it's wrong keeping with the continuity of how tape decks, and consoles work.

So, it was either overlooked??? or.... (more likely) there is a new setting somewhere, that we haven't found, to restore this to normal activity.

The question to Digi, simply is...

On a blank track, with no audio region, and the track record enabled, PT on "INPUT MONITOR" How can I meter my input signal, while PT is in "PLAY" - like it used to. ?
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  #3  
Old 06-24-2004, 01:48 PM
The Chinese The Chinese is offline
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Default Re: Why is track metering now so different?!?! arrgh!

Hey Guys...

works fine here....Check your prefs?

-Todd A.
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  #4  
Old 06-24-2004, 01:52 PM
The Chinese The Chinese is offline
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Default Re: Why is track metering now so different?!?! arrgh!

ohhhh...wait. Now I understand. You guys are correct. this feature no longer works... Interesting.

Hmm.

-Todd A.
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  #5  
Old 06-24-2004, 03:16 PM
KingFish KingFish is offline
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Default Re: Why is track metering now so different?!?! arrgh!

Yeah, went through all the pref's first night of a session with the new upgrade - just use a blank track (no audio regions) - rec enable it - hit play, and input monitor, you'll hear the source, but not see the metering until the track is in record, printing a region.

if there is an active region (for a punch, or selected region record) the meter is the audio file, NOT the input, even on input monitor.

PT always used to be, when you were monitoring input, you were metering it, in play, or record, on a record enabled track.

I'd almost consider this a "BUG" that needs to be fixed.
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  #6  
Old 06-24-2004, 03:33 PM
Randy Wright Randy Wright is offline
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Default Re: Why is track metering now so different?!?! arrgh!

Quote:
Yeah, went through all the pref's first night of a session with the new upgrade - just use a blank track (no audio regions) - rec enable it - hit play, and input monitor, you'll hear the source, but not see the metering until the track is in record, printing a region.



Maybe Digi's trying to force you to use your ears for setting levels....
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  #7  
Old 06-24-2004, 09:27 PM
Danny Caccavo Danny Caccavo is offline
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Default Re: Why is track metering now so different?!?! ar

I'm not following this.

When you are in playback, with a track record enabled, with the input button de-selected, you get disk playback and disk meter. You do not see input on the meter.

If you are doing the same thing and you click the input button, you hear and see input - like a multitrack machine.

In versions prior to 6.4, it worked the same way if you changed between "input only" and "auto input." Version 6, version 5....you did not see the input on the meter while hearing the disk. I do recall in the olden pre-TDM days that you did see input on the meter when in playback with a track record enabled.

What am I missing here?

Danny Caccavo
Digidesign
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  #8  
Old 06-24-2004, 11:05 PM
Natural Sound Natural Sound is offline
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Default Re: Why is track metering now so different?!?! ar

We're not on 6.4- I believe we're on 6.1 something, and I've noticed this a while back.
It was probably not working correctly to begin with, but we also enjoyed the ability to see what was going on in the tracking room while in playback. As mentioned above, it's obvious to see if the singer has started singing along or if there is talking going on while you're playing back a part. If the meter starts jumping, you can assume that the singer is talking (probably to you), So you look like a wizard when you stop playback to hear what their saying.
Basically it looks like they "fixed" it to work the way tape machines work, but I prefer the old "broken" way better.
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  #9  
Old 06-25-2004, 02:16 AM
Mt.Everest Mt.Everest is offline
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Default Re: Why is track metering now so different?!?! ar

Quote:
If you are doing the same thing and you click the input button, you hear and see input - like a multitrack machine.

In versions prior to 6.4, it worked the same way if you changed between "input only" and "auto input." Version 6, version 5....you did not see the input on the meter while hearing the disk. I do recall in the olden pre-TDM days that you did see input on the meter when in playback with a track record enabled.

What am I missing here?

Danny,

It was a great feature in v.5 Protools, that you would get a mixture of both sides of the coin. When punching in, you would hear playback of what is before the punch, but the meter would reflect the input at all times. That was GREAT because:
A) You would know that the artist was singing/playing along with the preroll. This usually makes for a smooth sounding punch. With new artists these days that are no where near as talented as they are good looking, I ALWAYS would stop playback if I didnt see them singing along and tell them they need to do so for a good sounding punch. V.5 Protools let me visually see if they were doing this.
B) Its helpful when auditioning takes to be able to see if the singer is yelling " Stop! Stop!" To tell me that a word they just heard was flat or something that I didnt hear. If I cant see them, I end up letting the whole thing play, only for them to say, "yeah there was a word back there, um, somewhere, I think, um, that was flat." Then we spend 5 minutes trying to find it again.
C) It is just very useful to SEE whats coming into the mic during playback, before a punch, for many reasons. For example, you can anticipate a performer playing louder than the preroll music, and give the mic pre a tweak on the fly if needed. Performers always play or sing louder when they know the 'red light' is actually on.

Also, what about the monitoring mode not sticking? In V.5 I could switch to Input-Only and KNOW it will stay like that no matter what tracks I record enable or not. It is VERY annoying when I am doing multiple tracks with one performer, and they want to always be in INPUT mode to noodle around with what is in playback at all times, recording it or not, that I have to remember to switch to INPUT monitor each and every new track I record enable!
Danny, do you see what Im getting at with this point? Every new track I record enable nulls out the Input-Only mode and requires and extra command everytime. That bogs down work flow and multitasking, no matter how small it may seem.

Hopefully I have clarified my points.

Quote:
Maybe Digi's trying to force you to use your ears for setting levels....

um, no. I hope you are joking. Using your ears is relative for levels depending on how loud you are monitoring. You want to be able to see headroom so you can anticipate loud passages, can anticipate all that I said above, and to make sure stuff is actually GETTING to protools in case a mic cable got yanked out or something. Do I really need to go on?

And NaturalSound, yes, the old 'broken' way is better and sooo much more useful. Maybe if enough people realize this minor but significant change and post about it, Digi will go back to the old way, or create some kind of preference to choose between old and new.

Thanks for the responses. I brought this up in a larger thread I started but I think it contained TOO MANY of my dislikes about PT6 for anyone to get thru the whole post!

Thanks!
MT

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  #10  
Old 06-25-2004, 11:13 AM
BlueDog BlueDog is offline
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Default Re: Why is track metering now so different?!?! ar

Just adding my vote to put it back the way it was. The reasons stated above are exactly how I used it too. Were people complaining?
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