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  #1  
Old 08-02-2006, 10:15 AM
deardaddy deardaddy is offline
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Default MS mess

Hi,

I'm mixing a documentary recorded in MS.
When I apply my usual MS decode plug (Waves shuffle or MS matrix), I only get a signal on the left channel.
I contacted the field sound engineer, he told me he recorded with a mono mic on channel 1 and a Bidirectional mic on channel 2.
I imported all his sounds on stereo tracks and put the MS decoder plugs on those stereo tracks.
My decoding plugs are set up as MS decode (no phase reverse, no channel switching).

What could be wrong ?

Thanks for your time.


Pascal
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  #2  
Old 08-02-2006, 10:54 AM
MissHiss MissHiss is offline
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Default Re: MS mess

Quote:
I imported all his sounds on stereo tracks and put the MS decoder plugs on those stereo tracks
Maybe you didn't mean to, but you did say "tracks." As in plural.

You really should only need one stereo track. You'll need to take the middle on the left and the sides on the right. The other option is to use two mono tracks, one panned hard left (middle) and one panned hard right (sides), then use the Waves M/S decoder on the master fader. This is often preferable because you can EQ the middle and sides differently, though this could also be done with some EQs that offer a multi-mono mode on stereo tracks.

Be aware that it is critical with the Waves M/S decoder that the left channel is also the middle and the right channel is also the sides. It won't work properly otherwise.
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  #3  
Old 08-02-2006, 10:54 AM
rhumphries rhumphries is offline
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Default Re: MS mess

Quote:
Hi,

I'm mixing a documentary recorded in MS.
When I apply my usual MS decode plug (Waves shuffle or MS matrix), I only get a signal on the left channel.
I contacted the field sound engineer, he told me he recorded with a mono mic on channel 1 and a Bidirectional mic on channel 2.
I imported all his sounds on stereo tracks and put the MS decoder plugs on those stereo tracks.
My decoding plugs are set up as MS decode (no phase reverse, no channel switching).

What could be wrong ?

Thanks for your time.


Pascal
It's probably the exact same audio on channels one and two. The left side gets the two identical tracks added together and the right side gets the two identical tracks added together out of phase, resulting in no signal.

-Richard
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  #4  
Old 08-02-2006, 11:08 AM
deardaddy deardaddy is offline
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Default Re: MS mess

Thanks for the replies.

In fact I meant Stereo track and not tracks, "mono" mic on channel L and bi mic on channel R, I put the decoder on the stereo track.

I guess Richard is right, I'll check if it is the same audio on channel L and R, although visually, it is not the same.

Thanks for your time.



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  #5  
Old 08-02-2006, 11:53 AM
Stuart P. Stuart P. is offline
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Default Re: MS mess

Hello,
I've seen something similar to this recently. A record team, I believe, had set up their Sound Devices 7XX recorders incorrectly. These recorders have facilities for creating submixes, and they can be set incorrectly very easily. What they did was, I think, is set the channel 1 properly, but then send a mult of that signal and mixed it with the side (channel 2) signal to the second track. In other words channel 1=track 1, channel 1 + 2 = track 2. Lot's of phase weirdness on that second track. That could explain why it's decoding so strangely. Just a thought...

Hope it works out,
S.
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  #6  
Old 08-02-2006, 02:39 PM
deardaddy deardaddy is offline
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Default Re: MS mess

Thank you guys for your inputs, it looks like Richard was right, I have the files in front of me and often L and R channels are the same but not always.
I will go through all the session and automate the decoder to work for each clip in its own way.

Stuart, I will be carefull regarding those devices in the future, thank you.

One more time you helped me a lot.

Thanks.



Pascal
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  #7  
Old 08-02-2006, 08:47 PM
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minister minister is offline
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Default Re: MS mess

did you try it 'old skool' but putting the L track center, duplicating the right track and swapping polarity on one the duplicates? that'd be a sure fire way to know ...

and, yeah, with lots of field recorded you can record to matrix in post or in the field. ... they may have screwed that up.
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