Clip gain or Volume Automation for S's on Vicals

[SpinningDisk]

Was wondering what would be the better option for removing S's on vocals if a Deeser won't work? Was watching Kenny on Groove 3 and he used Volume trim Automation which I like but if I ride the fader for the vocals during the song, which would be the better of the two? I know there's probably plus's and minus's.
Thank you for tine😊

John

[dr_daw]

Hey Spin,

I've never had to use automation for De-ess. What plug are you using for De-essing? I've always used the Renaisance De-ess with great success. Are you listening to the side-chain of the split to make sure you're grabbing the right frequency? ANother trick is to watch your tracking. Are you using a pop filter? I know they're for plosives, but I find it's also a good tool to get the singer the right distance from the mic. Another trick if that's not working is to tape a pencil vertically across the diaphragm to split the sibilance.

I think you should be able to get the de-ess to work, but it sometimes takes a little fiddling about.

Wes

[albee1952]

Good tips from dr_daw. I have a few techniques to cover different needs. +1 for the Waves Rde-ess(usually automated to bypass except for when its needed). Another trick is to call up EQ II as Audiosuite, find a bad Sssss and use narrow band EQ to fix(narrow boost, sweep till the Sss jumps out at you, cut there and render). And, sometimes, simply using Clip Gain on bad Esses

[JFreak]

Tip #1: record better
Tip #2: mix better
Tip #3: use the pencil or automation

If any of the above give you success, then try dynamic eq.

[SpinningDisk]

Thanks all. Makes sense. I'm trying to avoid automation if I can help it.
Yup. Got pop filter. I'm a good singer who's trying to do it all hehe.
Ok. I'll check out the Waves. I miss my Massey De-Esser😞
Well, if all doesn't succeed the first time, try again😚
Guess it's back to tracking vocals over. I wonder if my neighbor'shome?

[JFreak]

I'm sorry if my last post had too few words. We finns are famous of it, ask Kimi Raikkonen for example.

What I meant was sibilance most often is a cause for too hot recording levels. Try again with lower levels (your monitor controller has a volume control, right?) and be prepared to be amazed. Then the next step, mixing. Set up your compressor right. Don't be too concentrated to the wovel sound. You can get all the aahs and oohs you want by setting the CONSONANTS right. And if those two tricks don't help you, use the pencil tool to draw out excess sibilance.

[Craig F]

Kenny's video was pre Clip Gain and voices don't work that way any more so I would use Clip Gain if the De-Esser is not working
Take a look at McDSP's DE555 De-Esser http://mcdsp.com/plug-ins/de555/ and/or harass Massey to get the updates out

[SpinningDisk]

The latter sounds pretty good. Learned a lot from you guys. Thanks.

[citysoundman]

I always use volume automation for problem S's, the ones that the de-esser won't fix. There are always some esses that are too loud/harsh. Usually -3 dB of volume autiomation on the ess works brilliantly. As far as what do you do when you mix - I always mix in Trim automation mode (PT HD) so I'm just moving the whole automation track or up down. If you don't have HD (and don't have Trim) then I would definitely use clip gain so that the volume automation won't get overwritten by a mix pass.

[CygnusX-1Bk2]

Also mic placement is huge. Teeth don't line up perfectly and people's S sounds can be sharper on one side or the other. Having a singer or speaker (VO) say s words while you walk around them listening closely (provided you have space) one can cut down even having to use a de-esser at all. I do a LOT of VO work. For plosives there is always the pencil trick.