setting up 002R + patchbay

[pk_hat]

My new setup consists of just that, no mixer anymore. However...
I have a couple of 8 to 8 1/4 TRS balanced snakes, trying to figure out if there's a general rule of thumb regarding colours when making the connections. I had read about this a while back but can't remember where, something like Green/White/Black/Red, etc. I don't know if it even matters, really, maybe it does, but if there is such a rule, perhaps you can share?

Also, since all connections and phantom power switches are at the back of the unit, I'd like to have a mic and it's cable permanently patched in input 1, is it harmful to leave the phantom power on? It would be annoying to have to reach back there each and every time simply to turn the phantom on. Perhaps the only design flaw I can think of with the 002R, although a single input jack (XLR and instrument) on the front panel would have been nice too.

Thanks for any advice.

[audioeric]

Well.. I just labeled 16 snakes.. We put in all new snakes because we switched from ADATs (RCA on back) to HD24's (TRS).. It's nice to have a balanced cable now.. But, that was a LOT of work, and I was very glad that I labeled.. When they first installed the stuff in the studio, they did it one snake at a time.. so, 8 channels at the input, then hook those 8 up at the output.. No thanks.. Anyway, if anyone wants to know more, let me know.. As far as colors, I didn't know there was a general rule.. I made up my own.. Probably the best thing to do is make up your own, and STICK TO IT throughout your entire setup.. I did:

black
gray
white
red
orange
yellow
green
blue

in that order.. I figured it just made sense to me.. dark to light.. then the color spectrum..

now, in reference to phantom power, I believe someone said that ribbon mics are affected by having unnecessary phantom power on, but that's it.. On other mic's it shouldn't have an effect, but I couldn't say this 100%.. I guess I'm just used to turning on phantom power in a difficult way.. When I'm setting stuff up, it's usually staying that way for a while, and I go through an analog mixer to actually mix and then go to HD24's.. SO, I'm not going right into ProTools..

anyway, meaningless ramble..

eric

[pk_hat]

When they first installed the stuff in the studio, they did it one snake at a time.. so, 8 channels at the input, then hook those 8 up at the output.. No thanks.. Anyway, if anyone wants to know more, let me know..

anyway, meaningless ramble..

eric

huh?

Thanks for the reply, mate, but the above confused me. In any case, I guess colour really doesn' t have much importance, I'll just figure something out. I have to be honest that when it comes to patchbays and this whole normalled/half-normalled stuff, I get a bit queezy.

I started making connections between 002R and the Neutrik patchbay last night and often wondered if I was doing it right. I take it in a norm. or half-norm. setup, I shouldn't patch the outs and ins of the 002R in parallel on the bay, correct? As in, 1 through 8 top row is 002R outs, 1 through 8 bottom row is 002R ins. Not sure anymore, damn....

[audioeric]

Sorry, I was typing in stream of conciousness.. DOH!! I was just saying that they had originally just hooked up 1 snake to the back of the patch bay, then ran that over and hooked it up to the back of the ADAT, then went back and hooked up another snake the patch bay, then went back and hooked that up to the ADAT, and on and on, until all 6 ADATs were hooked up. Then they did the outputs of the ADAT, which go to the tape returns on the board, 1 snake at a time.. I would have hated to be there when they did all the inserts and direct outs for the patch bay I was just then saying, No THanks to doing it that way.. and that if anyone wanted to know more about the labeling thing, i.e. if they wanted the template or anything, let me know via email...

sorry, next time I'll try to proof read so it makes sense to everyone, and not just the voices in my head

as far as hooking up stuff to the patchbay, is there anyway to make it not normaled?? I know on ours, theres just a little chip that does it. You don't need them normaled, and I would think that you wouldn't want them normaled at all.

eric

[where02190]

Patchbays are extremely handy for inputs that are not easily accessed and nee dto be for a variety of differnt inputs. Our entire facility, every i/o is available in the patchbays, and I cannot imagine life without them.

Colorcoding. While there is no offical standard, many facilities use the standard resistor color code.

Best is to have a standard color code and label. the Brother P-touch series of labelmakers are great for this, along iwth a bit of heatshrink to protect the label.

While in most cases keeping the phantom on will theoretically do no damage, there are exceptions. Ribbon mics often will be destryed if +48 is applied to them. Also, the small arc caused by the connection to phantom mics when plugging in can pematurely degrade connectors. It is a shame that Digi was so foolish as to put the +48 switches on the back, very stupid design.

[pk_hat]

No worries about the rambling, quite funny actually.

As for the patching, well, there you go, I don't even know if I need to have it normalled, 1/2, or not at all. Perhaps I can give you a quick rundown of what I have in my setup, which is rather minimal.

Digi002Rack
Korg MS2000
POD kidney bean
Electrix Filter Queen
1 Technics turntable (plugged to Alt Src input on 002)
Alesis M1mk2 monitors (to 002 monitor outs directly)

That's about it, really. I just want a basic yet efficient patching setup, where I can route the Korg to say, the POD, or the Filter Queen (I suppose it would make sense to patch in, then).

It's the "outs over ins" that gets me between 002 and patchbay, 1through 8 for both ins and outs, or 1through 8 for 002 outs top row, then 9 through 16 for 002 ins on the bottom row? That's where I can use some guidance. Thanks!

[brinaddison]

All advice sounds good eccept!!!

Do not use 1/4 TRS jacks with Phantom power! This will cause a short circut when you plug in the jack. So you will need to turn off your phantom power before plugging in the 1/4" jack and then turn it on again. XLR is the only safe way. But unfortunately you don't have that option unless you create an XLR patchbay for your mics.

Phantom power is cancelled when a Dynamic mic is on that chanell so Dynamic mics won't be affected by phantom if it is on or off.

Ribbon Mics do not like to be plugged in or unpluged with phantom power on.........spells destruction.

On another note, Patchbay's rule for all other conections.

[where02190]

Definitely don't use any normalling patchbay with phantom on, as you short the connections briefly when patching, whcih can definitely damage circuits. The rule here, and msot everywhere I've ever worked is NO PHANTOM WHEN PATCHING, PERIOD. While the currnet is minimal, over time even XLR's will show damage when repeatedly patched with phantom power on.

[pk_hat]

I'll heed your advice, thanks for the warnings.

What I can do is leave input 1 on the 002R unpatched, no cables in the line input, since I only have one condenser mic anyway, might as well leave that XLR plugged in there and turn the phantom on when I need it.

However, can you give me some advice on my patchbay routing issue I mentioned above? Should I have the ins and outs of the 002 above each other on the same channels? Thanks!

[dans]

I have a condenser mic pluged into my Mackie board with phantom power on 100% of the time that I'm in my studio. Am I reading that some people think this is bad? I've never thought twice about doing this.