11r + pod hd500

[crhfish]

Like I said above, I tried it. I was going to keep it just for effects but decided that it would be overkill just to use it for effects. Remember its on the floor and the rack is not. You either have to have a computer set up with both editing programs open, or go back and forth. It was overly complicated for me also. I found a Lexicon MX300 at a pawn shop yesterday and its a much better effects tool, only $50. Scratched a bit, but it works.

[Jerry S]

Originally Posted by crhfish

Like I said above, I tried it. I was going to keep it just for effects but decided that it would be overkill just to use it for effects. Remember its on the floor and the rack is not. You either have to have a computer set up with both editing programs open, or go back and forth. It was overly complicated for me also. I found a Lexicon MX300 at a pawn shop yesterday and its a much better effects tool, only $50. Scratched a bit, but it works.

$50!?!?! Great find...I would first need to find me a pawn shop around these parts

[Badcard]

Well, in theory this should all work.
But at any rate, it's going to be a pain to write patches.
You should really ask yourself if this is worth the trouble.
I havn't tried the HD Pods yet, but I'll admit that on paper, the features are great!
I'd still miss the True-Z from the 11R if I was to make the switch, not to mention the studio features.
But for live use, the Pod really seem to be all that you need.

Maybe you should just keep the 11R in the studio and use the HD Pod live?
Sound quality might be a little different, but certainly not unusable I think.
The flexibility of the Pod makes it more suitable for live use, not to mention the complete set of Fx.

I'd love to see Digi/Avid play a bit of catch-up now...

[balance]

Originally Posted by Badcard

Maybe you should just keep the 11R in the studio and use the HD Pod live?.

That actually is what I'm leaning towards right now. The POD is so easy to play live because it's a one-box solution and for my use (Worship team at Church), it would be more than adequate.

[adamqlw]

I was initially tempted to do this. However...

I think one of the most important features of a modeler is convenience. With the 11r, I've traded the portability of a floor unit for the convenience of having something with knobs at eye level. I already dislike the fact that I need to bring a separate foot controller with a power supply.

If I went with the Pod HD500, I would need to bring more cables to run the 4cm method, as well as that brick of a power supply. Maybe if they release a rack mount version I would consider it, but I just don't see myself using it all that much with the 11r.

The number of amps and fx on the 11r remind me of something that Garth said on Wayne's world. It's like a new pair of underwear... At first, it's constrictive, but then it becomes a part of you.

[udamann88]

Originally Posted by adamqlw

The number of amps and fx on the 11r remind me of something that Garth said on Wayne's world. It's like a new pair of underwear... At first, it's constrictive, but then it becomes a part of you.

Hey adamqlw,

That's funny Garth just told me that last week too..........Lol

I'm not a smart Mann, but I know what 11-Rack does.......It ROCKS.....Peace! Forrest (X) Gump

[blewis]

Note: This post has been edited and I've adjusted my attitude a bit in the process...


Regarding using the HD500 as a MIDI Controller for the 11R

Starting with the following feedback posted on a Line6 forum

The midi board functionality HD500 is not flawless.
http://line6.com/community/message/187088

My background: BSEE degree. I have the Moog MP-201 which has turned out to be a nightmare to use with the 11R. I wanted to buy the IK Stealthboard, but they're like 10 years behind and I don't trust them to deliver anymore.

WARNING: I'm about to be a total A-Hole here. If I'm wrong, I'll swallow my pride and correct myself... (actually I've already had to edit my post since I was wrong about some things)

I viewed the HD500 as a $250-300 MIDI controller with a $250 modeler inside.


I can confirm that in the current v1.10 version of firmware for the HD500, its works with some headaches with the 11R. (I had earlier declared it a TOTAL FAIL).


LEDs and their Relationship to MIDI messages:

- I can confirm that assigning a footswitch to send a MIDI CC does not show LED status of the MIDI message being sent.

- You can remedy this by assigning FX in your HD500 chain to HD500 footswitches. For example, use the footswitch to control the HD500's reverb and use the same FS to control the 11R's reverb. When you do this, the LEDs toggle to show the status of the HD500's reverb state (see other problem below). This does not appear to work if you've assigned a FS to the HD500's FX loop however.

When doing this, you MUST BE VERY CAREFUL of the states of the FX on the HD500 and the state of the controlled FX on the 11R. Remember the light on the HD500 shows you the state of the HD500 FX ONLY. It DOES NOT reflect the MIDI state being sent to your 11R.

Initially, I did not realize this and I was completely pissed that when I turned on the reverb on the HD500, the 11R's reverb would turn off. Before making a FS assignment to the HD500 effect, you must 1) make sure that the 11R's FX has been switched as the result of the HD500 sending a MIDI CC to the 11R. 2) Using the enter button on the HD500, make sure the state of the HD500 FX matches the state of the 11R FX. Then 3) press and hold Enter. Something rather disconcerting happens here. When you first press Enter the state of the effect toggles. Then after you've held Enter, the HD500 realizes that you meant "press and hold" and it toggles the state of the HD500 back to its original state. You can then hit the FS you want to assign to the effect.

Now, this is a bit weird at first and took me at least an hour to figure out, but this flexibility allows you to run ON HD500 FX while turning OFF 11R FX. Ultimately, it's pretty flexible.

As far as I can tell, the only way to "sync up" the states of onboard FX on the HD500 and the 11R is to edit the state on the HD500. There appears to be no way to invert this CC notion and resolve the states by changing the MIDI CC value - as opposed to modifying the HD500's effect state. I've tried modifying the CC Toggle message - it lets you select between 000 and 127 - but it has zero effect in resolving the conflict.

It would be nice if Line6 added a "MIDI CC" effect so one could observe the state of the MIDI message being sent with the LED light and not have to use a HD500 effect just to get a light.


Footswitch Persistance Through Patch Changes

- I can _not_ confirm what this poster on the Line6 forum says about the FS state persisting even when HD500 patch changes occur.
- Actually, I have seen this happen but only with the Toe Switch on the Expression pedal. All other FSs seem to get "loaded" when a patch change occurs.


<deleted rant where I had the audacity to give the Line6 guys a lesson in digital logic and MIDI> ;-)


Expression Pedal:

The expression pedal on the HD500 is awesome! It can act as and switch between two controllers EXP1 and EXP2. It also has a built in toe switch and the toe switch _claims_ it can toggle 2 separate MIDI CCs identified as A and B (to denote them separately between the CCs sent by EXP1 and EXP2)

There is a bug in v1.10 where the toggle message A and toggle message B cannot be assigned to separate MIDI CCs - adjust A and it overrides B. Currently a FAIL, but hopefully they'll fix it. I have been able to assign EXP1 to control 11R's volume and EXP2 to control 11R's Wah, and I've been able to configure the toe switch to enable and disable 11R's Wah - but not without some random experimentation as I couldn't make heads or tails of the toe switch programming verbiage displayed on the HD500 - I suspect the toe switch bug is playing a part in this being as confusing as possible.

I have found programming the Expression pedal to control the 11R's Wah possible, but very confusing. I have also found that if I switch patches on the HD500 (and thus the 11R) while the Wah is enabled, the 11R and the HD500 lose sync and the Wah switch works oppositely. I've been able to re-sync them by, again, switching patches with the Wah enable.

When I first got the HD500, it was on version 1.1. The first firmware upgrade went to 1.10, so you can see these guys are really busy.

Perhaps I made a bad call and maybe IK will get it right after 8 months of tweaking...

Let me also add that including the MIDI CC reference in the user options of the 11R is TOTAL GENIUS.

The bank changes and program changes work as expected. For example, ask the HD500 to switch to Bank1 Patch1 and it'll tell 11R to switch to A1. HD500 Bank1 Patch4 -> 11R A4. HD500's Bank2 = 11R's bank B.

I did not do any experiments trying to access 11R's lower case banks like "a1" instead of "A1". I can't comment if that's possible.

But out of the box, the patch changes worked as I wanted them too.


Another Note:

HD500's MIDI setup is per patch. You tweak a patch all day to get it right, and then you have to manually do it in the next patch too. The hardware I/F does not appear to have a copy/paste for MIDI setups, but the HD500's software might.

Final Note:

I'm doing all these experiments from the HD500's hardware interface. Perhaps I'll give the SW I/F a whirl this weekend and see if things are more apparent or have a different behavior.

Laters... blewis

[djemass]

I will not buy any Line6PODHD because it will not solve what lacks already in the 11R, ie delay spillover nor Custom IR slots. PODHD doesn't do them. However, stereo delay of Line6 PODs has always been great and I think PODHD has a cool Harmonizer. Come Digi guys, please move on, your amp sims are top notch, but your product lacks a lot of things... It is really a pity.

[adamqlw]

Originally Posted by djemass

I will not buy any Line6PODHD because it will not solve what lacks already in the 11R, ie delay spillover nor Custom IR slots. PODHD doesn't do them. However, stereo delay of Line6 PODs has always been great and I think PODHD has a cool Harmonizer. Come Digi guys, please move on, your amp sims are top notch, but your product lacks a lot of things... It is really a pity.

I think I may have to eat my words..

I saw these videos, and now I want one

http://www.gearwire.com/line6-pod-hd500-part1.html
http://www.gearwire.com/line6-pod-hd500-part2.html

I think the effects and looper in a portable format that sounds pretty may be useful for something after all! Now I just need to wait until I can afford them both :)

[blewis]

FWIW, I have updated my original post on using the HD500 as a MIDI controller. My post is now more informative, accurate, and a bit less harsh. ;-)