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  #1  
Old 02-01-2005, 11:29 AM
rockrev rockrev is offline
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Default Making ReDrum Sound Like Real Drums

Ok, the timeless quest . . . making MIDI-triggered drum samples sound like a real drum kit. Notice that I said "kit."

I realize that Reason's ReDrum isn't the best format for such, but it's very quick and easy to program via a MIDI controller, cut & paste bars, and ReWire (mix or individual) to PT. So easy. Now, making them sound realistic is a different thing. No matter how nice your samples are, they just don't sound like a kit as a whole (missing bleed, room reflections, etc.). You see, adding groove error and velocity difference helps the feel, but . . . the sound remains sterile. Here's what I've done to help . . .

Waves TrueVerb. Soak down a 2-track mix of your kit with this baby (try "drum room" setting first), EQ, mega-compress, then blend it back in with the original tracks. Almost like a fake room mic. It does help . . . some.

Now my biggest problem is the cymbals - still very sterile. Anyone come up with a successful way to make them sound more like overheads instead of samples? Keeping them panned close to center helps, but then your image gets a little thin. Hmmmm . . . ideas?

rockrev
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Old 02-01-2005, 11:36 AM
neeel neeel is offline
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Default Re: Making ReDrum Sound Like Real Drums

Buy Reason drum kits DVD. http://www.propellerheads.se/product...ction=drumkits

I have had it for about two weeks and it rocks.

Redrum is ok for simplistic patterns but there are only so many things you can do with one sample per channel.

Multilayering is the key.

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Old 02-01-2005, 12:34 PM
neomodo neomodo is offline
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Default Re: Making ReDrum Sound Like Real Drums

So I find that stcking sounds helps a ton and also applying compression appropriately to each drum - Ultimately you end up with a million effects on the Reason side but the sound is good.

I will agree that Cymbals are tough and I am still working on ride cymbals.

Another thing that helps is using loops - I find loops that have the right elements and stack those puppies accordingly.

There's a little bit of documentation on the Propellerheads site dealing with a way to take REX files and load them into NN-XT - I'm thinking of trying it out today.

Also a cool article on using Matrix to create/trigger different drum parts using different tempos etc... brilliant way to create entire song parts/variations from the basic standard loop you create.

There are a few resources out there for crispy awesome samples - In short with the exception of the ride cymbals I have pretty good "drum kit" that loads as part of my default template.
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Old 02-01-2005, 12:49 PM
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lemix lemix is offline
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Default Re: Making ReDrum Sound Like Real Drums

I was a bit hesitant to step into this thread, but...
"Programmed" "Samples" coming off a (however good) library will miss "Reality"...always !
Too clean, too perfect, and seldom ( just from what I've heard..) include the "Environment", where the individual drums resonate together, in the same room, at the same time !
Now, of course one can "Program" great grooves...but NOT the "Air" surrounding it.
Sorry if my views are not agreeable, this is just IMHO..

happy tooling all,
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Old 02-01-2005, 01:26 PM
rockrev rockrev is offline
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Default Re: Making ReDrum Sound Like Real Drums

Lemix,

Thanks & yes, that's the problem. Good samples are easy to find now, but to get them to sound like a kit . . . no success. I mean, if you replaced every element/track of a drum kit (save the overheads and rooms), that could sound close to real (so long as the samples blended well). Take away the OH's & the room(s) and your left with lifeless drums.

Most of the groups I record have a drummer, it's just my stuff that I'm using ReDrum, loops, etc. for. Loops can sound pretty good, but you have to fit them into the song, or fit the song around them (unless you want to spend an eternity slicing and dicing). Anyway, I was just curious. I think this is the final frontier for sampled beats. Groove error and velocity adjustment made a major difference, but ambience and the realism it provides is still missing. I will continue to work on this problem. I have some ideas on simulating overheads (kind of like I did with simulating room mics), but it will take a lot of tweaking. I'm not sure if it will be worth it, but I'm going to try.

rockrev
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Old 02-02-2005, 01:28 PM
x9blade x9blade is offline
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Default Re: Making ReDrum Sound Like Real Drums

reason drumkits,you have to put in some time and tweak but, its very interesting
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Old 02-03-2005, 02:16 AM
neeel neeel is offline
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Default Re: Making ReDrum Sound Like Real Drums

You're right, reason drum kits do take a bit of tweaking but the degree of control it give you is amazing.
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Old 02-03-2005, 03:41 AM
Bob Legs Bob Legs is offline
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Default Re: Making ReDrum Sound Like Real Drums

I dont do alot of sequencing, but I do use a trigger midi converter for replacing dodgy kick sounds and sometimes toms and snare.
when u trigger midi from accoustic drums theres more of that human feel to them, something to do with the velocities of the drummer.
and you just plug redrum or kontakt into your new midi track and off you go.

but I prefer using AKAI sample cds to reason refills, i dont know what it is but it justs sounds better. there are a few programs for previewing and extracting samples from akai cds, like kontakt.

Quote:
Cymbals are tough
damn straight
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