Would it sound better if I...

[shabbar3]

hey guys so I mix in PT 9 but I am not getting a good mix at all. I need to know how to get a good mix. I am not technically prowess but I dont know if something like this can happen. I want to get a D/A converter, and send my plug ins through the converter to make it back into the software to make the sound better. I dont know if this is feasible or not. I just want to make better mixes thats all so suggestions on how to do that would be great or a piece of gear that I should buy.
P.S. Im not an engineer but I know plenty to make a good mix but PT isnt cutting it.
Thanks, Shabbar

[albee1952]

Sorry for the teasing, but your post supports that you're no engineer(YET!), but having good ears is the most important thing, so welcome to the DUC(and bless you for honesty) and let's see if we can't help. What you described about converters and plugins is not feasible. There are a few things to consider here. One; how is your monitoring setup? If you can't hear accurately, you are screwed at the start. Decent speakers help, but they also need to be setup correctly(both placement and settings for level and EQ) and the room needs to be treated to some degree(the best speakers can sound like crap in a bad room). Two; once you have that sorted, the next thing is to get decent sounds recorded, which means good mics, good preamps, good sounding sources and proper recording levels(and the room can affect all this as well). Now having said this, you can still get good recordings with basic stuff(like an Mbox and 1 or 2 reasonably priced microphones). No need to bust open the piggy bank just yet(and Pro Tools can sound as good as any DAW, so its up to the engineer.....you!)

Why don't you describe your setup in some detail and include info about the style of music and such so the rest of us can tailor advice to fit your situation As for room treatments, there is a ton of good info on the web. Just google things like room tuning, bass traps and acoustic treatment and do some reading.

[Keybeeetsss]

^^^What Albee'sure said^^^

#CremeFraiche

[Dism]

Originally Posted by Keybeeetsss

^^^What Albee'sure said^^^

#CremeFraiche

[shabbar3]

First of all..thanks for the real helpful response..Before I list the set up and style of music let me tell u that I am in the midst of getting a preamp which u can say is good or even recommend me a good one..I was thinking of Grace design 101 mic pre, OR Avalon 737..anyways here it goes
Mics-AKG Preception 220 condesnor, Senheiser E835 dynamic
Guitar processor-Eleven Rack-Epiphone SG (Guitar)
Modulator/input-Line 6 Toneport UX2<<I think this is a main problem in my amateur studio as eleven rack goes through this as well as the mics and I dont like the sound quality..although the gearbox is convienent the fact that you can just turn it on whenever you want and use the mic is fun..
Speakers-M Audio studiphiles AV40..I think these are decent but I can def buy KRK rockets just because I heard about them ALOT
Genre-Now a bit tricky Ive been experimenting alot so its a little varies but still the same box..Rock, Grundge, Orchestral,Ambient,electronic,industrial,hip hop (considering electronic beats). But ya thats what I have going and OH BTW NOOO sound treatment whatsoever..

[zedhed]

Originally Posted by shabbar3

I want to get a D/A converter, and send my plug ins through the converter to make it back into the software to make the sound better.

There are plugins that emulate analogue so the last thing you want to do is send a signal through an extra stage of unnecessary DA/AD conversion.

Originally Posted by shabbar3

P.S. Im not an engineer but I know plenty to make a good mix but PT isnt cutting it.

If one can't make a good mix with Pro Tools, they aren't going to get one using anything else. The first thing a bad tradesman does is blame his tools! You may say you know plenty to make a good mix but all indications point to the contrary. I don't mean to sound harsh, but good mixes take a long time of hands on experience. There are no short cuts no matter whether using high or lower grade equipment.

Originally Posted by shabbar3

Guitar processor-Eleven Rack-Epiphone SG (Guitar)
Modulator/input-Line 6 Toneport UX2<<I think this is a main problem in my amateur studio as eleven rack goes through this as well as the mics and I dont like the sound quality..

It was suggested in other threads months ago that you should try to use either the Eleven Rack OR the Tone-port...in other words, use them separately. Not sure if that advice was ever taken but you might be surprised at how much better the sound may be by trying it.

As far as all the other equipment goes, it doesn't matter much what one gets if they don't know how to use it. I would suggest doing some research and study to gain a solid understanding of sound engineering principles. By doing that, you won't need to get the subjective points of view from anyone else on what equipment to get because you will know exactly what you need to enable what it is that you want to get done.

Getting a good mix is no different than a musician mastering his/her trade....practice...practice...practice....oh and did I mention practice.

[shabbar3]

Ya I did remmeber getting the advice for using the 11r for the main driver. But I dont hear any difference from the toneport which is hard to believe I feel like the input output might be some issue. Such as the fact that the 11r main outs go in the toneports stereo in. I dont know may be if it does, but you are right about the practice part I feel like thats all the 2 cent advice that i need. But I also feel like If i had an avalon 737, it would help give compression/eq hands on give me a a better understanding

[albee1952]

Originally Posted by shabbar3

First of all..thanks for the real helpful response..Before I list the set up and style of music let me tell u that I am in the midst of getting a preamp which u can say is good or even recommend me a good one..I was thinking of Grace design 101 mic pre, OR Avalon 737..anyways here it goes
Mics-AKG Preception 220 condesnor, Senheiser E835 dynamic
Guitar processor-Eleven Rack-Epiphone SG (Guitar)
Modulator/input-Line 6 Toneport UX2<<I think this is a main problem in my amateur studio as eleven rack goes through this as well as the mics and I dont like the sound quality..although the gearbox is convienent the fact that you can just turn it on whenever you want and use the mic is fun..
Speakers-M Audio studiphiles AV40..I think these are decent but I can def buy KRK rockets just because I heard about them ALOT
Genre-Now a bit tricky Ive been experimenting alot so its a little varies but still the same box..Rock, Grundge, Orchestral,Ambient,electronic,industrial,hip hop (considering electronic beats). But ya thats what I have going and OH BTW NOOO sound treatment whatsoever..

Just my 2 cents on the above; I think the Grace preamp is excellent. The Avalon is certainly good(and really popular) if you don't mind the price. You might consider the Grace with a good compressor as a recording chain(Distressor, UA1176), but you also could use some better mics. The AkG is a lower end condenser, and the 835 is a solid live mic, but not something I would reach for when recording. Sadly, I have to say the AV40 speakers are pretty much crap(aka computer speakers) and I would not be counting on them for much(although I would keep them around as a reference for comparison in the way that Auratones were back in the day). The KRK's are a step up, but I would try to get to the Rokit 6 as the minimum(the 5 is just too weak on the low end without a sub). You will still need to do something in the way of acoustic help for your room. Early reflections can be helped some by foam products, so check out www.foambymail.com for a bargain. Bass traps will help to balance out the low end, or you could check the low end with a good set of headphones(but that requires a "good" set of phones). For recording guitar direct, I must say, the new POD HD sounds really good

[Hercules]

Hey shabbar,

Have you thought about going on a 1 or 2 day training course? I think skills rather than equipment will help you more at the mo'. Perhaps SAE or some mob like that runs condensed courses in L.A.?

[zedhed]

Originally Posted by shabbar3

Ya I did remmeber getting the advice for using the 11r for the main driver. But I dont hear any difference from the toneport which is hard to believe I feel like the input output might be some issue. Such as the fact that the 11r main outs go in the toneports stereo in. I dont know may be if it does, but you are right about the practice part I feel like thats all the 2 cent advice that i need.

God Bless ya little cotton socks son. One thing you are showing is a willingness to hang in there and get the job done...I like that!

Originally Posted by shabbar3

But I also feel like If i had an avalon 737, it would help give compression/eq hands on give me a a better understanding

For learning purposes I would suggest using the compression/eq & for that matter all plugins included in Pro Tools. That way there is no need to spend more money and once learned, can yield a great mix.

Money saved there could be wisely spent on doing a course as Hercules suggests. I think for someone in your position they should be focusing on making their next mix better than their last, one step at a time, rather than holding a perception that equipment will bring the elusive instant 'Perfect Mix'.