Guitar tone reduced in Pro Tools 10

[trainwrecktwostep]

Zolko, the zero latency stage of the interface is bypassing the DAW. No way to record both through the DAW, to my knowledge. Yes, I'm playing on both sides of the A/B test. And I have just listened to my buddy the same way while he plays. That's where I get that there is a difference, and he confirms that its there. And as with the zero latency stage, there is no way to get the recording from the direct out of the amp through the DAW, unless I'm, well, going through the DAW. And ASIO4ALL with an Apogee Jam is no different: it sounds better before going through my computer/dAW, so Im just going to keep working on this. The amp and the interface are fine, so I will try your advice, Katherine, and trash my preferences and settings, etc., and try a different DAW like Reaper. I've tried disabling the dynamic plugin processing which doesn't change it, and I don't have any problems with leaving it enabled which is a bonus! I'm currently putting together a PC, so I'll have some new hardware to put into this. Thanks for your input.

[mesaone]

I'm sure you've thought of this, but here's a shot in the dark to narrow down the possible cause.

• You're monitoring the loopback (zero-latency monitoring) through headphones. Playback from PT sounds different. Are you still listening through the headphones? If your playback is on speakers, then it will sound different than the headphones.
• Are you matching the amp output to the correct interface input (not running line out to Hi-Z in, for example)?

[trainwrecktwostep]

mesaone, thanks for your ideas. Yeah, I've done both strictly headphones and strictly monitors comparisons. It never occurred to me about the impedance issue, so I tried that, but I'm fairly convinced the tone issue is a small enough difference that I'm going to roll with it and get on with things, see what the outcome is in the final mixes, and if it's good, then it's good! I just use a separate rig with minor tweaks in the Kemper Studio EQ and it's good. I haven't tried a different DAW yet; for now, I'm just staying on top of keeping PT running smoothly on my system and being productive with song ideas.

Tried using S/PDIF, too, maybe a 1394 connection would help, but I'll have to wait to test that for when I get a new system. It's tax return season, baby!

[Bill Denton]

There's connections and then there's connections...

We need to know:

Exactly which outputs are you using on the Kemper, exactly which inputs on the Scarlett, and exactly what connectors are on each end of each cable. We also need to know which jacks the headphones are being plugged into...

If got a feeling this might be the problem...

[Katherine_Focusrite]

Going back over this thread I notice one thing I didn't pick up on before.

The OP states that he was setting the unit to DAW Tracking, meaning hearing the outputs of Pro Tools only and it sounds slightly different than Zero Latency Monitoring, which is the Hardware Monitor Path.

I have personally had many a conversation with other studio engineers about the sound of different DAWs Mix Engines.

I can say I and many others can hear a slight but audible difference between the same dry WAVs brought into Pro Tools versus Logic.

I know some people who are very perceptive of this and thus take a preference to Logic over Pro Tools even though they prefer Pro Tools' work flow.

Remember that when a DAW combines raw WAVs into a stereo bounce or output it is using math and not all DAWs use the exact same algorithms.

This may be what you are hearing. Test out a few other DAWs trial versions and see if you are one of these rare engineers that finds they have a preference to a particular DAW's Mix Engine.

Best regards.

[Numi]

I used to have the same experience with Cubase, and it was part of the reason I left it..to ultimately end up using PT's instead(along with many other issues with Cubase I won't go into right now). Something to consider, although it may not be affecting what you are hearing or not. I noticed that when I adjusted the Panning from -3db to -2.5 to 0, that it changed the way it sounded to me. Its only a volume thing..but sometimes it can cause a perceived difference when comparing the source and recorded material.

This may have nothing to do with your issue, but it was something I noticed in a similar quest I had sometime ago. You can adjust the Pan Settings in the project settings to 0 and then compare the source with the recording material and see if sounds different or similar in that regard. It could just be a volume thing.. or not. Good Luck!

[trainwrecktwostep]

It's been three years, and I've finally tried Reaper, because I washed and dried my iLok...

Katherine from Focusrite indeed had some good advice about trying a different DAW. I am 100% certain that there is a difference between PT and Reaper regarding the issue I posted. During the time since I posted about the audible difference in tone while recording, I have upgraded to PT 11 and the same change between running through the Zero Latency Monitoring and DAW monitoring stages on the Scarlett are there: the tone is less accurate through the DAW monitoring stages.

This is not the case with Reaper. The DAW monitoring stages of the Scarlett, while running Reaper, are not discernible from the Zero Latency Monitoring stages. This, along with the nice feature of easily arming/unarming single tracks for recording just by selecting back and forth on the track I want to record, which I do not have with PT11, means I will be using Reaper to record guitars and either one to record probably everything else and then to mix and master (haven't explored MIDI instruments as far as recording/editing in Reaper). I'm very used to working with PT and all the shortcuts, etc., so I'm gonna go ahead and blow $40 on a dongle.

Easy for recording two stereo guitar takes on L/R tracks as I write riffs. And the sound from the Kemper --> Scarlett 8i6 --> DAW is accurately reproduced on the track and during live monitoring.

[mesaone]

You'll rarely meet a person who is more pro-PT than me. But if Reaper does what you need, then keep using Reaper.

I don't like how the routing is done in Reaper, and I don't like how the editing tools are integrated. But there's no doubt that it is an incredible value.

[trainwrecktwostep]

Hi mesaone, yeah, I'm definitely gonna use both, I'm just clear on the differences. Multiple projects and subprojects in the same "session" is a plus for relegating riffs quickly to other songs or to other places. It's enough to make me learn all kinds of stuff over again to use another DAW for writing, heh...

Maybe I'll wind up coming back seeking help about the exciting things I'll run into when I try to switch all of my projects from Reaper over to PT to mix and master.