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Old 07-31-2008, 11:19 AM
Mark Dann Mark Dann is offline
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: NYC, USA
Posts: 762
Default Make the master fader a recordable track!

This is an idea I have for running mixes within Pro Tools, that I (personally) think beats our current options. My background formally is tape machine - large format console, hence my approach.

Currently we have two major ways to run a mix. Bounce-to-disk, and busing all tracks to an audio track placed in record (I am purposely excluding running out of the interface to whatever...). Both have their shortcomings.

What I propose is the make the master fader a recordable track, so that whatever would normally be output to your monitoring system simply gets recorded. This would more or less be the same as busing, except without the hoops. Let it have it's own dedicated "input" toggle, which would function the same as a 2-trk return switch does on a standard analog console. The toggle would go between letting you hear what you are currently outputting (just as it does now), and letting you hear your already printed mix(es). Let it have playlists. Let the plugins each have a pre-post toggle, so as to have to option of printing mixes with or without any or all of them.

There's plenty of extra space in the master fader strip for the few extra icons, and running mixes like this is more or less the same as what we have been doing for decades with non-virtual gear.

Why do I think this is better?

BTD: You are locked out of the system while it runs. You are forced to give your mix a name, location, other info (big time waster in of itself), and there are the occasional issues. Sitting there watching a long song run off is a colossal waste of time. You can't punch in or out of it, so making any last minute changes could result in running the ENTIRE mix several times. I stopped using this years ago.

Busing: You must re-assign all channels to this bus. If you forget, you still hear non-properly assigned tracks, but it doesn't get recorded. If your session travels somewhere else, they have to figure out and deal with your busing, and some PT guys downstream and not that swift. If you create a NEW track, it is by default NOT assigned to your bus. If your mix track's input is NOT set to pass-through (input light "on"), you could be listening to an old mix while you scratch your head wondering why you can't hear changes you are making (this gets me once in a while, even after years of doing this).

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Old 07-31-2008, 12:42 PM
mhmh mhmh is offline
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Frankfurt, Germany
Posts: 515

Since I do analog summing and record back on two tracks in Pro Tools this is kind of what I have.
I would probably miss it very much if I would work ITB, so I can really comprehend your wish.

Mac Pro 2,4 GHz 12-Core Intel Xeon (Westmere) 32 GB RAM, OSX 10.10.5, HD I/O 16x16 analog, HD I/O 16x16 digital, 192, PT HDX2, PT HD 12.6.0

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Old 07-31-2008, 04:27 PM
studiojimi's Avatar
studiojimi studiojimi is offline
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,115

it would be nice to be able to use the scubber when bussed

right now i can't use it the way i set up my record to disk

but how will the fade work when one is needed?

will the fade record as well?
PT10.3.10/HD6/192w16in/MTN.LION OS 10.8.5 / Westmere MacPro 8 Core W/20gRAM MAGMA-PE6R4/TDM&RTAS/WAVES Platinum/UA/Eventide Plugs/I usually record at 88.2
With GOD as my partner. . . I need to make my plans LARGER.

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Old 07-31-2008, 05:13 PM
Craig F Craig F is offline
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 12,591

I was thinking of a Master Fader/Record Track interlock

So if you were using PEC/Direct switching between Bus and Track (especially if one had a CB or Sound Master paddle controller)

"Fly High Freeee click psst tic tic tic click Bird Yeah!" - dave911

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Thank you,

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Old 07-31-2008, 08:52 PM
Mark Dann Mark Dann is offline
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: NYC, USA
Posts: 762

Yes of course the fade would work. The idea is that whatever you hear through the master fader, is what gets recorded.
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Old 07-31-2008, 09:44 PM
c-tone c-tone is offline
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,091

Originally Posted by Mark Dann View Post
Busing:...If you create a NEW track, it is by default NOT assigned to your bus.
FYI - You can change settings in your I/O setup that will make your new tracks default to your mix buss.

This is the first thing I do when setting up an ITB mix. The last thing I do before printing the mix is to double check that everything is assigned to the mix buss (and only one stereo track is going to outputs 1-2, which goes to my monitors).
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Old 08-01-2008, 07:06 AM
Eric Seaberg's Avatar
Eric Seaberg Eric Seaberg is offline
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 1,820

I've gotten into the habit of assigning everything to busses and use an AUX fader as a master with its INPUT from the mix bus.

The OUTPUT of the AUX can then change to feed the MONITOR OUT while working, or feed another STEREO BUSS to an AUDIO track for recording back into the session. The output of that track feeds the MONITOR OUT while in record.

It works great and, as has been mentioned a lot elsewhere, since you're recording the mix back into the session you're able to make realtime mix changes as well as 'punch-in' on the mix when you hear something you don't like. It's really saved me a lot of time.
Eric Seaberg • San Diego, CA
A.E.S., I.E.E.E., S.M.P.T.E., S.P.A.R.S.
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Old 08-01-2008, 08:55 AM
ashdot ashdot is offline
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: Tel Aviv, Israel
Posts: 206

This is a great idea.

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Old 08-01-2008, 10:20 AM
dogon dogon is offline
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 169

The only problem with this great idea is that the inserts (on the master fader) are post fader and if it was to work like the current record tracks, post tape/disc (record). So if you want to compress or eq your mix you will once again have to create a buss to mix through
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Old 08-01-2008, 10:33 AM
Dopamine Dopamine is offline
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 1,497

Yeah, that would be great if they could get that to work. I don't like wasting the tracks (and cluttering the session) with a new stereo track to record to..

You should send this into Digi's feature requests.
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