Logic Pro now costs $199 !!!! Are you watching Avid?

[spenner]

Originally Posted by getz76

New entrants into the market space are going to have to make a decision; $200 for Logic Pro or $600 for a semi-crippled Pro Tools. Plenty of us have a preference to Pro Tools because of familiarity. I do. But go in completely green, on paper Logic has Pro Tools beat nearly everywhere for a third of the price. Right in the Mac App store, right after the kid gets addicted to Garage Band.

Not good.

IMO it's lack of features that is mostly hurting Native right now. Logic already has many of the features PT lacks, so they can drop the price like that and not worry about having to implement track freeze, offline bounce etc. I don't expect PT native to be $200 any time soon because these features need to be implemented.

I'm just not too sold on the model of a company, for pro music, that has kids jamming on an iPad, also marketing iphones with angry bird apps to the same kids. Also, how many people are gonna want to buy an over priced Mac just to use $200 Logic Pro? So where is the market for new customers, particularly those happy on PC who do not want to be beholden to one platform, or want to be bothered with learning another one?

[BGMusic]

Originally Posted by M.K.BEAT

This is a BS statement. The mentioned "Pro Audio Division" is still there, alive and kickin'...old Emagic guys are still there too and a lot of new faces...

BGMusic, you seem to have some problems...

Best,
m.k.beat

Have you called there lately? I think you're living in the past. They are all gone.

[getz76]

Originally Posted by spenner

IMO it's lack of features that is mostly hurting Native right now. Logic already has many of the features PT lacks, so they can drop the price like that and not worry about having to implement track freeze, offline bounce etc. I don't expect PT native to be $200 any time soon because these features need to be implemented.

I completely agree. If Pro Tools with the Complete Music Production Toolkit was $600, they could get away with the pricing. Almost equivalent on paper and industry professional standard? More expensive but also more "pro".

Originally Posted by spenner

I'm just not too sold on the model of a company, for pro music, that has kids jamming on an iPad, also marketing iphones with angry bird apps to the same kids. Also, how many people are gonna want to buy an over priced Mac just to use $200 Logic Pro? So where is the market for new customers, particularly those happy on PC who do not want to be beholden to one platform, or want to be bothered with learning another one?

I disagree. You and I might not take Garage Band on an iPad or iPhone seriously, but go talk to some kids in high school. That's where the future money is. If those kids start thinking Pro Tools was "Dad's DAW", Avid is screwed.

And while Pro Tools 9 and later is a lot more forgiving, getting into Pro Tools on a Windows machine still involves work. Not that the work is hard, but you still have to do some research and have the right setup for it to work. I am not saying Windows is not a valid platform for Pro Tools. But, compare this to Propellerhead's Reason 6 as an example. Plug and play instead of worrying about what chipset you have. The barrier to entry is there for Pro Tools compared to their competition in the Windows space. And when you are talking about the emerging users, that's going to be a real problem. That might be addressed in Pro Tools 11, assuming it makes it to market as specified.

[M.K.BEAT]

Originally Posted by BGMusic

Have you called there lately? I think you're living in the past. They are all gone.

Then I am gone too...

It seems that you don't have a clue but you are still telling BS...

Greetings from my fellow emagicians,
best,

m.k.beat

[spenner]

Originally Posted by getz76

I disagree. You and I might not take Garage Band on an iPad or iPhone seriously, but go talk to some kids in high school. That's where the future money is. If those kids start thinking Pro Tools was "Dad's DAW", Avid is screwed.

Hmm, I don't know. Hopefully daddy and mommy will keep buying them those toys. For me, there is a thick line between young professional audio rebels going from tape machines to DAW's, and marketing GB on an iPad to someone who knows nothing about recording or how audio works.

And while Pro Tools 9 and later is a lot more forgiving, getting into Pro Tools on a Windows machine still involves work. Not that the work is hard, but you still have to do some research and have the right setup for it to work. I am not saying Windows is not a valid platform for Pro Tools. But, compare this to Propellerhead's Reason 6 as an example. Plug and play instead of worrying about what chipset you have. The barrier to entry is there for Pro Tools compared to their competition in the Windows space. And when you are talking about the emerging users, that's going to be a real problem. That might be addressed in Pro Tools 11, assuming it makes it to market as specified.

It really is not that difficult to use PT on PC. The balance of those who can't run one track on Windows with Pro Tools with those of us running solid and stable favors the latter. Logic lost me as a customer years ago for going to one platform. At the end of the day I don't see how that helped them or how that will change now, still being one platform. (Regardless of the price).

[RTFM]

Originally Posted by BGMusic

Have you called there lately? I think you're living in the past. They are all gone.

No, the Emagic guys are still there. You may be thinking of the phone support for Logic, which has changed a lot over the years, but those were not developers.

[getz76]

Originally Posted by spenner

Hmm, I don't know. Hopefully daddy and mommy will keep buying them those toys. For me, there is a thick line between young professional audio rebels going from tape machines to DAW's, and marketing GB on an iPad to someone who knows nothing about recording or how audio works.

The kids barely know what a CD is. Forget about tape. Young professional audio rebel is such a small population that there is not a lot of incentive to market to them. You may consider them toys, but companies like Apogee understand that this is the point to get someone to identify with your brand from early on.

Originally Posted by spenner

It really is not that difficult to use PT on PC. The balance of those who can't run one track on Windows with Pro Tools with those of us running solid and stable favors the latter. Logic lost me as a customer years ago for going to one platform. At the end of the day I don't see how that helped them or how that will change now, still being one platform. (Regardless of the price).

It is easy. That's not the point. The point is a kid can have a brand new laptop running Windows 7 and it may not run Pro Tools. That barrier is there for Pro Tools while it is not there for the other Windows 7 DAWs.

Originally Posted by spenner

Logic lost me as a customer years ago for going to one platform. At the end of the day I don't see how that helped them or how that will change now, still being one platform. (Regardless of the price).

Final Cut has not had a problem, I think because most people are less worried about the platform and more worried about the application.

[spenner]

I just don't see it that way. I guess we'll see how it turns out.

[mike connelly]

Logic also does surround mixing for that $199, that's what, $2600 to get PT to do it?

I don't think people are going to switch just based on price, but at $199 even more audio pros on other apps will get it just to try it out. And I'm sure many will have their expectations exceeded (at least if they take the time to dig into the app).

And Mainstage for $29 is an absolute steal with not much competition in that niche.

Originally Posted by BGMusic

As I pointed out, Apple has gotten rid of the entire pro audio division. All of the old emagic guys are gone.

Source? I've heard totally the opposite. And whoever is there now is certainly cranking out plenty of bug fixes to the app. If there's any loss of resources at Apple, it's because that same team also has to work on Garage Band (including the iPad version), although there's some overlap since GB uses Logic's audio engine and plugins.

[TOM@METRO]

If the price/performance issue were the end of the equation, one would have to include Reaper in the discussion. The deal is though, if one must earn a living recruiting and maintaining clients, the name “Pro Tools” offers an enormous marketing advantage.