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  #1  
Old 07-07-2014, 10:13 PM
DavoBali DavoBali is offline
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Default BEST SSDs for use in Pro Tools ? - New Samsung 850 Pro

Hi there , I am buying a new mac pro soon and want to buy an external storage unit to house SSD drives - to store all my ...,

- pro tools audio / project files,
- Samples,
- V.I samples etc ............,


What SSD drives do you recommend as superior performance and also best quality and long life usage "


So far I only know of ;


- Samsung 840 Pro (512Gb) - I dont think these are yet 1TB ??? ...., and,

- OWC 480GB Mercury EXTREME™ Pro 6G SSD
2.5" Serial-ATA 7mm Solid State Drive
(link) - http://eshop.macsales.com/item/OWC/SSD7P6G480/

- I also saw this today , a samsung 850 Pro (available 21st July) that is 1TB
(link) http://www.anandtech.com/show/8216/s...ter-the-3d-era




This is the External enclosure I like so far - OWC Thunderbay 4 , It has a thunderbolt 2 connection................,


(link) - OWC Thunderbay 4 SoftRAID 5 Thunderbolt Drives & EnclosuresDual Thunderbolt 2 | RAID Ready | 4 Drive Bays | Mac

and for SSD installation it needs this adapter - (Link) - http://eshop.macsales.com/item/NewerTech/ADPTADRV/


....., I dont want to run raid software on these , I just want the quick speed of the SSd's for quick read and write for protools and loading of V.Is ....,



- any thoughts or recommendations
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  #2  
Old 07-07-2014, 11:41 PM
DavoBali DavoBali is offline
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Default Re: BEST SSDs for use in Pro Tools ? - New Samsung 850 Pro

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darryl Ramm View Post
You are limiting yourself to consumer class SATA III drives? Then...

Samsung 840 Evo (the Evo is avaialbe in 1TB, is uses lower cost/denser TLC flash)
Samsung 840 Pro (there is no 1TB 840 Pro and there never will be, they use less dense/more expensive MLC flash).
Samsung 850 Pro (I'd give it a while in the market before rushing to buy any totally brand new drive, initial prices are also a bit high, they use new very impressive looking VNAND MLC flash).

Seems silly to go for more than an Evo for sample drives.

Micron M550

Don't buy the smallest sizes of any of these drives, as they are a bit slower due to decreased internal fan-out., besides at the current great prices you might as well buy larger drives that will last longer and be more useful.

They are the only consumer SATA drives I'd look at today. I dislike Sandforce, their (past) problems, and the whole idea of manufacturers using third party firmware, so the OWC drives are a no go for me.

Now how are you going to connect them to your Mac Pro? You need a SATA to Thunderbold dock solution. This one looks great for low-end use http://www.sonnettech.com/product/ec...rboltdock.html there are lots of other multi-disk dock options, but I'd certainly look at Sonnet Technology over OWC products. Whatever you get make sure it supports EFI/booting.

But as always when doing this you are now your own systems integrator, do you want to do that?

Another very nice options is the current Lacie 1TB Little Big Disk 2, it uses two Samsung PCIe flash cards, so bypasses the SATA limits. One or two of those (slightly expensive) Lacie boxes would be my strong personal choice for a Mac Pro today.

And in general SATA is a rapidly dying disk technology, everything is going PCIe, and especially NVMe. If are say a post house and have more serious IO demands, and budget, then its a much longer conversation -- and there are great NVMe enterprise class SSDs from Micron and Samsung (and more coming). The trouble is Apple completely screwed over the whole IO story with the Mac Pro by deprecating PCIe and make you try to suck IO though a thin Thunderbolt straw. NVMe disk technology is going to drive more demand for direct PCIe access. Apple zigged when everybody else is zagging.

And once you have your SSDs make sure they are set up properly, including updating firmware if needed, using Trim Enabler and over-provisioning the drives. All discussed here on DUC in many other posts.
Wow great info Darryl , Ive noticed you are an authority of a great wealth on this forum regarding anything mac related .......,

Thanks for helping lift the grey cloud for me on this subject , as I,m still trying to "come to grips" with all this technology.

Those suggestions you made look perfect ,

- firstly the thunderbolt 2 docking station you suggested, is a good compact solution to a lot of things missing from the mac pro , which would make for easier access for starters , and for somewhere to just store more sata drives. Also until I upgrade my interface for something better , my current MBox pro interface can make use of its onboard firewire port also

- 2nd the lacies little big disk looks great just for running the pro tools project files in and out of - as you only get One TB with this so as it fills up I could move older projects out of the LBD and onto other drives and import them back in if need be .



So with the above scenario of having the thunderbolt 2 docking station + Lacie Little big disc ......,

- would you recommend to set it up like this ? (below)

- to only store those V.I samples etc
( like my Toontrack superior drummer SDXs, N.I Komplete ultimate libraries etc) - on a sata drive inside of the sonnet docking station


..., and just dedicate the LBD pcie only for my protools projects folder ?



just to understand some other things you mentioned ...,

re; "Whatever you get make sure it supports EFI/booting." , Does this mean having capability to boot maverics from that disc incase a re-install of maverics is required ?

also re; "But as always when doing this you are now your own systems integrator, do you want to do that?" ...., I am unsure what this means

once again Darryl , thanks for your valuable input
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  #3  
Old 07-08-2014, 07:20 AM
DavoBali DavoBali is offline
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Default Re: BEST SSDs for use in Pro Tools ? - New Samsung 850 Pro

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darryl Ramm View Post
The 1TB Lacie is a dual 512 GB SSD system, which you should use as two separate drives. If you samples could fit on 512 GB and you could live with 512 GB of audio drive I would just do that.

If the Lacie is too expensive then you can go for the Sonnet dock and drop two SSDs into that.

By system, integrator I mean exactly that, you are putting together all this stuff and need to be technical enough to do that, debug problems etc. If you don't want to do that, then the Lacie is even more attractive.
.
Thanks again Darryl ,

So Im digging the idea of that the Lacie little big disc. Although my V.I samples alone are 500 GB.

The other 500 GB pcie should be plenty for my pro tools projects , with the use of various back up drives.

RE ; working with Video......, As I have not done any video work , and at this stage I do not plan on starting any either ...., so therefore I was just wondering as impressive as the Lacie little big disc is - if its could be in anyway "overkill" for just audio use in pro tools or not ?

...., meaning will those super high speeds that the LLBD is capable of be utilized enough to justify the cost ?

- If the answer is yes - the speed will be utilized and make everything run better , than IMHO its worth it .


...., in the end Id just like to make pro tools run natively in the NMP as best as it can (as I have too much invested already in native plugs), and be as stable as it can with the minimum of errors.



My location is making things difficult , and even buying the NMP ,


I am hoping to buy the 4 core NMP from the US (via an Indonesian Authorised Apple re-seller) ..., and have it sent to OWC for upgrading to 8 core (@ 3.3ghz) with more ram (either 32 or 64 bit)

....., but ATM im waiting for a reply from the local authorized apple re seller if they can organize it or not (with OWC)


http://blog.macsales.com/23567-owc-i...e-mac-pro-2013


I like this option as ,due to the price of upgrades being much cheaper from OWC than Apple (and better specs)

...., as they will get the mac back into Indonesia and pay the proper import tax required without being scammed by customs like I would trying to do it alone .

My easier alternative is to just order a 6 core NMP locally from the reseller ( but in indoesia the resellers will source the NMP from singapore , where they have the same 220 volt power plug as here in indonesia)

...., but if I took that option .., then Id like a 500 gb or 1 TB pcie installed as the factory 250 GB is too small for my needs, & so is the factory 12 GB of ram. This id be hoping these could be upgraded (in singapore) like they are in the US etc .



FYI - I was planning on the 8 core @ 3.3Ghz upgrade from OWC ..., instead of just buying a standard apple factory 6 core @ 3.6Ghz - with the intentions/ hope that Ive no shortage of CPU power to load up as many plugs as my hearts desire (so to speak), and never again be super annoyingly restricted as I am now

- Once I have the NMP , I dont think I will be going over 50 tracks max either on my largest sized projects ..., I also use lots of V.Is / midi tracks in my projects .



cheers
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  #4  
Old 11-13-2014, 10:36 PM
glenwwatkinson glenwwatkinson is offline
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Default Re: BEST SSDs for use in Pro Tools ? - New Samsung 850 Pro

Hi Darryl,

Looking through these threads I've noticed that you seem pretty knowledgable in SSD troubleshooting.

I've got a frustrating problem that may not be as difficult for you to understand as it has been for me.

I run PT10 on my 2010 iMac. Had to upgrade to an SSD as a particularly heavy session couldn't get data fast enough from my 7200rpm Lacie.

I'll preface this next bit by stating that I am awful in computer speak. I really just know enough to get by and make music.

I picked up a Samsung 850 Pro SSD which I've got plugged into an external SATA to Thunderbolt adapter by Seagate.

When I plugged the SSD in, the iMac said it isn't readable. I opened the Samsung CD installer via WineBottler, as it was an .exe file. That opened the installer for the Samsung Magician software alright. I installed the Magician software. But here's the problem: the Magician software opens up and says it's "reading the drive" but then crashes after about 5 seconds.

I've read a bunch of forums regarding updating firmware and DOS boots and/or using a PC to update firmware on the SSD and things to that effect. But to be honest I have no idea how to do this properly and I'm wondering if you do. I've been looking for a simple step-by-step solution but haven't found any. If you (or someone) have a dummy-guide of sorts that'd be a lifesaver.

Thanks in advance.
I've got an amazing hard drive here that will save my session that's due in 2 weeks if I can get it to work.

Thanks again,

Glen
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  #5  
Old 11-14-2014, 01:49 AM
VRW VRW is offline
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Default Re: BEST SSDs for use in Pro Tools ? - New Samsung 850 Pro

I think Darryl will be able to tell you the right stuff but in the meanwhile let me ask you 2 things.

Have you just formatted it the right way via Mac OS Disk Utility...it has to be Mac OS Extended
Journaled ONLY to work/to be read properly?

2nd as far as I know you can´t use Samsung Magician Software on a Mac, it´s for Windows only!
May read these entries there for example...
https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5182811

Actually you don´t need the Magician Software on Mac OS and there are even no firmware updates
required/available for a 850 Pro as you can see on the Samsung page there (you may scroll down on the site for it).
http://www.samsung.com/global/busine...downloads.html

I use myself 2 Samsung 850 Pro in 2 different Macs and they are amazing!
If one still needs a SATA SSD the 850 is the ultimate choice and definitely worth the money.
I also have used a 840 Pro before and there are really noticeable improvements with the 850.
It´s quieter, faster, more stable in a way and it works just more smoothly all in all.

Actually there should be only one thing to do with a new 850 Pro to get it to work properly...get it formatted the right way.
There is nothing else to do unlike with all the 840 models (from Evo to Pro) which you already have firmware updates available for.

If having formatted it right and still having issues you might also check your enclosure as well as your whole connection
(the adapter e.g.)!

Btw don´t forget to use Trim Enabler finally to get your 850 work as fast and as long as it should. There is a free version you can use.
http://www.cindori.org/software/trimenabler/


All the best to you,

VRW




Mac Mini i7Quad, 16GB Ram, MBP Mid 2012 2,5GHz i5, 16GB Ram, MacOS 10.10 Yosemite, Apogee Quartet+Duet 2, Genelec Active,
Yamaha NS10, Pro Tools 11.2.1, Logic 10.0.7, Waves, MCDSP, Duende Native, Softube, HOFA, IK Multimedia, NI etc.
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  #6  
Old 11-14-2014, 02:11 AM
VRW VRW is offline
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Default Re: BEST SSDs for use in Pro Tools ? - New Samsung 850 Pro

P.S. I have read your posting once again and have you tried to use a PC to do all the stuff to your 850?
You should not do that if you are going to use the drive with Mac OS finally.

Actually it could be a formatting issue the other way round too...means if you would have tried to use a PC
to do that all and your drive had been formatted in the Mac OS Extended Journaled format before, Windows
will not be able to read it anyway!

As far as I remember a drive doesn´t even appear in Windows with that format unlike to Mac OS where you can´t
write to NTFS (the Windows format) but drives being formatted in NTFS can be read at least.

Anyway. Whatever you have tried to do it is simply not necessary actually for a 850!
Get it connected to your Mac, use Disk Utility to format it the right way, install and activate Trim Enabler and you
should be ready to go.

No firmware update needed for a 850. It´s not even available from Samsung.

If there still should be an issue you may check all the other stuff too (enclosure, connection) as mentioned before.

The best of success again!
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  #7  
Old 11-14-2014, 10:05 AM
Drew Mazurek's Avatar
Drew Mazurek Drew Mazurek is offline
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Default Re: BEST SSDs for use in Pro Tools ? - New Samsung 850 Pro

Warning: thread hijack!! Sorry, but there seems to be some SSD gurus here!!

I recently installed Crucial SSDs in my laptop as well as my wife's. Mine was a 512, her's was a 256.

Short version:
Her's has been flawless, all good.

Mine... takes up to 4-5 minutes to boot, but once up, performance is great, no complaints.

Strange fact: If I boot into Safe mode, it'll still take a while to boot, but on the restart after the safe boot it boots in 15 seconds like you'd expect it to.

I've been in touch with Crucial CS but nothing they've told me helped.

TRIM is enabled BTW.

Thanks in advance for any info anyone might have.

And again, sorry fro the hijack.
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Old 11-14-2014, 10:40 AM
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Drew Mazurek Drew Mazurek is offline
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Default Re: BEST SSDs for use in Pro Tools ? - New Samsung 850 Pro

Sorry!!

Crucial M500s.

My computer is a 15-inch, 2.53GHz, Mid 2009, her's a 2012 13".

So, try cloning it, wipe and reinstall?
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  #9  
Old 11-14-2014, 12:11 PM
Darryl Ramm Darryl Ramm is offline
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Default Re: BEST SSDs for use in Pro Tools ? - New Samsung 850 Pro

Running Windows or OS X? Version?
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  #10  
Old 11-14-2014, 12:50 PM
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Drew Mazurek Drew Mazurek is offline
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Default Re: BEST SSDs for use in Pro Tools ? - New Samsung 850 Pro

Os10.9.5
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