How do you use an analog mixer with Protools?

[JCBigler]

Addmitedly, this may be a dumb question. But, I've always always mixed in the box or on a digital console, I've always wondered...

What is the process for using an analog mixer in Protools? How are the inputs and output routed (both to and from Protools)?

When you see guys mixing on older large format analog consoles and still using Protools, what is their method for assigning the console input channel strips to a Protools channel during the mix?

Or are most of them just using the console as the input device and routing the direct output of each channel to an input to the Protools interface? And then once the audio is on the hard drive, they are just mixing in the box?

I understand this process when using a digital console, or a cntrol surface. I'm just wndering what the process is when using an analog console.

[Drew Mazurek]

Originally Posted by JCBigler

I understand this process when using a digital console,

Essentially it's the same. And there are many ways to do it.

1. PT strictly as a Multitrack recorder. 1 channel on the console per track in PT, both In and Out.
2. Console as a "front end" to your system, basically pres and EQ/DYN for recording, then all ITB from there.
3. Opposite of #2, lots of tracking of individual mics, but then each track out to the console for mixing/summing.
4. any combination in between. i.e. drums individually out to the desk while everything else comes out in groups, or is mixed all ITB.

Really, there are no rules. Do what you like/need. Of course you do have to be careful about things like adding compression on the console to a track coming from PT that has automation on it. Your automation will be "pre" compression instead of the normal post like if you did on the desk.

[elicious]

Just to add what Drew says
since, based on your other threads, it looks like you're trying to set up your own studio.

you can run all signals through a patchbay.

In the patchbay the connections can be "normalled" between either ProTools or an analog deck and the analog desk.
that way there's no need to run cables, ins and outs are already patched in,
and when you want to patch around it, that's easily done at the patch bay.

(we also use an Elco connector so we can switch between ProTools or a Studer multi track as the tape deck.
In our case, with 192's we have 24 in and 24 out to match the analog machine.
or you could add a 2 track deck to bounce mixes through, as well. )

When tracking, all the mic pre's on the analog console are in the mic position,
and then simply reverse those to line in when mixing through the board,
or use the small faders to create a monitor mix.

In the old days you would set all the ProTools faders at zero
and then do all the level balancing from the analog board;
that's no longer necessary, you can use the automation from ProTools quite well.

And of course the nice thing is once the signal is out in the analog world
it's easy to patch in things like 1176's or other hardware processors.
e

[albee1952]

Not a dumb question at all Good stuff already, but I will add this for consideration; if you don't have an HD, HDN or HDX setup with plenty of analog IO, I wouldn't bother, unless you have a small desk that sounds really good, and will use it just for analog summing.

As for hardware inserts, again, unless you have lots of IO, its pretty tough to find hardware these days that doesn't have a really good virtual replacement(and my Waves Puigchild cost a boatload less than a Fairchild at $18K). I use a few hardware compressors for tracking, but also mix all ITB.

Every time I start thinking about an analog mixer, I just look at the control surfaces that are available and the old mixer idea goes out the window pretty quick for me If I can find the cash, an s3 will do a lot more for me than any analog console I can afford(if you can buy a Neve....I am all for it)

[JCBigler]

I would be fine mixing everything in the box also, and just use a control surface. I think it makes for sense with the automation ability in Protools also and automated faders and settings, etc..

My partner on this project likes the idea of a big analog console. We'll see if I can't persuade him change his mind on that.

Having said that, I'm still just a little mystified about the actual hook, routing and operation of the analog console/DAW set up.

Anyone have a system diagram for such a system that they would like to share?

[Wall2Wall]

IMO, there isn't a newer analog console that's worth it. They all lack the sound of the older consoles and many don't even have recall features. A few summing boxes with a tone may work better ala Chandler minimixer, burl b32, aurora audio sidecar, etc.

Older consoles with a sound come with a whole host of other issues. High electric bills, maintenance costs, and HVAC.

[RiffVomit]

Thanks for the reply. My main concern would be to put on like a live show and capture that as a live recording. I would use the console to EQ the signal a bit before it hits PT tracks but have them come through as individual tracks. Right now I seem to only be able to send through the Aux sends 1 & 2 giving me one stereo track.


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[JFreak]

Originally Posted by RiffVomit

My main concern would be to put on like a live show and capture that as a live recording. I would use the console to EQ the signal a bit before it hits PT tracks but have them come through as individual tracks. Right now I seem to only be able to send through the Aux sends 1 & 2 giving me one stereo track.

You need to use Direct Outs of your console, and check for manual if it is pre-eq or post-eq (might need to open it to change behaviour). If it cannot be done on your console and the direct outs are pre-eq always, then you are out of luck regarding eq but can still use preamps of the console. If the preamps are not that good, rent a splitter and record from there with better preamps.

Also just stating the obvious; after the show is started, do not touch the preamp gain and be careful with eq tweaks.

[RiffVomit]

Thanks. Yeah, what I’m seeing is all pre-EQ so defeats the purpose of what I wanna do. However, it seems using a TRS to TSF adapter may solve my issue. Maybe find out tomorrow.


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[albee1952]

Using the correct tool for the job is always a good idea, and the Yamaha isn't the correct tool. Using a mixer that allows for easy multi-tracking would seem to make more sense. Behringer X32(including the smaller versions or the rack version) patched into a computer would allow you direct multi-track recording into any DAW to get a live performance into the box(the same can be said for many other brands of affordable digital mixers. The X32 is just an example). Once the files are in the computer, Pro Tools(or any other DAW) will allow you to edit and mix as you wish. Yes, its money to spend, but its also the way to reach the desired goal