Audio Past Black & Network Spots

[SPC]

Hi,

1) What is the official word on audio going past black? The composers give us music that ALWAYS rings-out past the last frame of picture (this is for series work), so these days I cut it at the last frame of picture and try to fade out nicely. I do notice (on some other shows) that many times I see the "act" end and then there is at least a full second of black before the first commercial. In that instance music was NOT cut off and did ring-out while in that black... then commercial. What's the deal? I believe if a "spot" went say longer than the :30 seconds, it would get cut off right? Is there a buffer of black for act-outs?

2) With regards to spots, I know they're mixed hotter than most show/series but the spots built by the actual network (WB, FOX, etc...) seem to be even hotter! I think at the network they're going beyond -10dbfs. And maybe the NON built at the network spots "are" limiting to -10. What do you know?


Thanks

[bigbadhenchman]

Black=No sound.

If there is sound in the black, there's a good chance QC will reject it.

[cosd]

SPC-

I work in the master control section of a T.V station. I ingest all the programming and commercial spots into our server. For programming, I will mark out at the first frame of pure black, eliminating every thing afterwords. As for commercials, they tend to fluctuate. If a spot doesn't reach it's allotted time, (:30) I will usally round up. Let's say video ended at :28.20, I'll round up to :30 leaving :01.10 of black. If there is sound in that portion black, we might send it back or let it play, depending on how close it comes to :30.

To sum up our stations procedures:

Programming- Doesn't matter because it getting cut off anyways, always sounds better with a fade.

Commercials- Audio & video should end simultaneously.

[SPC]

Great. So I have been doing the right thing (cutting music at black and going for a nice fade out).
Do anyone else have this issue with composers writing (or ringing out) past black?

Lastly, can someone also talk about spot levels. Meaning, aren't the Network promo spots and even the news, mixed hotter than -10dbfs (at the station)? Should the product spots (KFC, Office Max, etc...) that we mix be locked under -10 if the networks are actually mixing hotter? Will spots get rejected if they're at -8 or -6? Ha, ha, "then what the heck it the ref tone for, huh"?

BTW: thanks for your speedy replys!

[Eric L]

I have been taught black=no sound as well. However, watching Lost on ABC last night, I paid close attention to the outs and found that every single commercial break ended with a music sting hanging over the cut. Not by a frame either. More like a second. So the programmer is not cutting off at the first frame of black. There must be a documented last frame of picture different than the first frame of black.

But, even more bothersome, is the amount of out of sync dialogue on the HD broadcast of this show. Unfortunatley, it is not a global shift. It appears that this is an ADR heavy show (all the crashing waves), so this may be it. But that doesn't explain the high level of tape dropouts (both audio and video) in many past episodes. Even green digital noise on the screen.

Are these tapes being Qc'd?

I love the show, but I'm really surprised with the quality of the broadcasts. Anyone else notice this or is my DirecTV playing tricks on me?

[Richard Fairbanks]

I wish folks like you who are actually working with the crap that we deliver could contribute here more often. Thank you!

[The Chinese]

Are these tapes being Qc'd?

I love the show, but I'm really surprised with the quality of the broadcasts. Anyone else notice this or is my DirecTV playing tricks on me?

Maybe it's the Layback.....

he he.

-Todd A.

[bigbadhenchman]

Do anyone else have this issue with composers writing (or ringing out) past black?

Always.

[bigbadhenchman]

But, even more bothersome, is the amount of out of sync dialogue on the HD broadcast of this show. Unfortunatley, it is not a global shift. It appears that this is an ADR heavy show (all the crashing waves), so this may be it. But that doesn't explain the high level of tape dropouts (both audio and video) in many past episodes. Even green digital noise on the screen.

Are these tapes being Qc'd?

I love the show, but I'm really surprised with the quality of the broadcasts. Anyone else notice this or is my DirecTV playing tricks on me?

I would say the Green is becasue of a bad feed. And the out of synch I've seen issues before when it was an HD broadcast. If the dialogue is a little soft, then a bad HD layback will have it completely out of synch.

[Eric L]

Damn the D5 and it's insert offset! Ha!