Artist Controllers and EuCon with Mountain Lion 10.8?

[Herbieoz]

Originally Posted by JC Haydon

There are a LOT of people using EUCON and Artist Series, with a multiplicity of configurations. As I read through these posts I am recognizing a few voices full of anger directing discourse, often ignoring the advice, substantive and sagely perspective, and positive input from others.

We can work on EUCON features for EUCON aware apps who are actively developing for EUCON, or we can work on old protocols, hacking together APIs for a non developed legacy. I advocate for a EUCON that is more stable, faster, and more efficient. What do you think?

JC

Thanks for asking. Eucon that works well would be my desire. My sophisticated desire would be to have more control over Eucon - e.g. as is found in both D-Command systems and HUI (et al) protocols, whereby multiple units are able to be ordered/assigned (e.g. within Protools). I guess this is not your concern however, more the purview of ex-Digi department of Avid. A single "button-push" to enable Eucon is not flexible enough for advanced users with complex requirements.

So yes, my 2 cents worth would be Eucon that works well, that does not then also 'break' other aspects of functioning protocols, or work only at the expense of other protocols. (also considering OSC functionality is not present in any of the Avid devices that I am aware of). i.e., while there is a valid argument that we should not be early adopters to 10.8, in two contexts I have no choice but to work on computers with 10.8. On both these machines Eucon does not work at all. All advice has been followed repeatedly in the hope that some fix will stick at least once - but to no avail. Not complaining - early days for 10.8 - and I have been a Mac developer, I know the communication/information secrecy etc issues that surround Apple, and I also know that Digi and Apple have long standing tension (well, at least for the last 14 years anyway).

When interfacing with hardware and software, HUI (which is not deprecated) is still a viable method for interactive communication. It also keeps functioning perfectly well when Eucon is completely broken (for some of us). Logic suggests if nothing else that the poor cousin remains a viable solution for productivity sake. Correct me if I am wrong, however the HUI protocol does not require intensive API development, it is Eucon that still has bugs and kinks because it is a more sophisticated and complex protocol with more that can go wrong?

Or am I missing the point of your question?


(PS - while there are certainly some who more incensed than others, I can also see many posts also by people who are rationally trying to sort through the issues to get a working solution. I would hope you can see all views clearly for what they are.)

[soratach]

Originally Posted by Herbieoz

(PS - while there are certainly some who more incensed than others, I can also see many posts also by people who are rationally trying to sort through the issues to get a working solution. I would hope you can see all views clearly for what they are.)

Well said.

JC, sorry if i made my post sounded angry. Like many others have mentioned, through out this forums and many other forums regarding the 'Artists' units, that there are so many bugs and problems along the line and most of them are still standing, correct me if I'm wrong. I know you guys over at the AVID are probably working as hard as you can. But you have to see these problems from our, customers', point of view as well. The 'Artist' units aren't cheap, they cost a fair deal. But is it worth it? well, on youtube or and other promo videos, yes it does! and it even does when the device is working properly. Like other people have said, you sold us a great piece of tools, yet the supports aren't quite there to solve all the problems! I understand that you want to make sure that everything is perfect before the release, well here's the news, it never was. Sorry again if i'm out of line but that's how I truly feel and i'm sure many more would agree. And frankly I'm not ignoring any advice nor positive comments, I just couldn't find one. All I can crack down is, keep cool and wait. It's a pain to sit here working while a 1000 pounds worth of equipment is sitting duck.

So, am I angry? No, I am not. I understand you guys work hard and the issues are complicated. Frustrated? Yes. Just wanna share how I feel. I sincerely hope that Eucon will become solid soon, I really like the machine when it's in sync with my software.

good luck with it.

[Recording Room]

Originally Posted by JC Haydon

We can work on EUCON features for EUCON aware apps who are actively developing for EUCON, or we can work on old protocols, hacking together APIs for a non developed legacy. I advocate for a EUCON that is more stable, faster, and more efficient. What do you think?

JC

I'm all for never developing for legacy. Complaints about Artist series not working with HUI etc... frankly... if you want HUI / Mackie go use that. If you want straight up EUCON with protools, Logic etc... then that is the right thing to do. I'm also for dumping support for old operating systems and supporting only 10.6 and forward. If you're still on 10.5 I have to question why. Stability is not the right answer. I'm also for supporting only 2 major versions of daws, and in some cases only one. For example I see valuable support for protools 9 and 10, but only for Logic 9 and not before.

That said, you also have to be sure to stay on top of system updates from apple using the developer program so that when a new OS is released, you are at least only a week or so away from releasing an update that works with it. Yes, I know apple can change APIs during beta releases, and frankly the continuous changes are not that huge and don't impact everything, so there is no real excuse for why you shouldn't be able to start working during those developer releases; it's what they're there for, no?

Also, Euphonix hasn't released an update since 2.6.2, so that's hardly a complaint from users who don't listen to others, it's a complaint that there are known problems which haven't been addressed since October of 2011... that's not acceptable either :)

[robertg]

What kind of problems are people having with mountain lion and the artist series?

ML has significantly optimized video performance, so it's completely worth the upgrade and I'd like to know if the MC controllers will be unusable. I even ordered a newer Mac Pro w/ 64bit EFI just to run ML.

[Herbieoz]

Originally Posted by Recording Room

I'm all for never developing for legacy. Complaints about Artist series not working with HUI etc... frankly... if you want HUI / Mackie go use that. If you want straight up EUCON with protools, Logic etc... then that is the right thing to do.

Just to correct your misunderstanding, there is no one advocating for further development on legacy - just that MIDI/HUI support is not broken. Not a hard request, right down there on the minimal side of things really.

[KristianNielsen]

Originally Posted by ingeniousp

But I can't use Ableton live 8 because when I add it to the list using the Mackie Protocol it disappears after restart. In 10.7 changing the preferences folder permissions fixed that problem but not in 10.8. Is there a work around for this?

I'm having the exact same problem, which isn't very practical as Live 8 is my main DAW. I've tried the various suggestions on how to fix this matter, but without luck. If anybody has an alternative suggestion, it would be highly appreciated.

[Recording Room]

Originally Posted by Herbieoz

Just to correct your misunderstanding, there is no one advocating for further development on legacy - just that MIDI/HUI support is not broken. Not a hard request, right down there on the minimal side of things really.

Actually it wasn't a misunderstanding :) I AM advocating just stopping where it is. Yes, leave it broken. I know folks using the MIDI/HUI support will probably cuss me out, but the fact is that spending valuable engineering time to stabilize something they likely won't be able to stabilize for long (because specs change so fast), takes away from developing the native part of the platform.

Just my opinion, not meant to offend anyone.

[Artist PM]

Guys,

I like the way this thread is going.

Just for the record, HUI/Mackie Control emulation were not intentionally broken.

So to distill this all down, the newly introduced issues since 2.6.2 that you are experiencing are:

• Mackie/HUI connectivity
• Retina Display graphics anomalies on Mix/Control
• 10.6.8 connectivity issues

Am I following?

Thanks,
JC

[Recording Room]

Originally Posted by JC Haydon

Guys,

I like the way this thread is going.

Just for the record, HUI/Mackie Control emulation were not intentionally broken.

So to distill this all down, the newly introduced issues since 2.6.2 that you are experiencing are:

• Mackie/HUI connectivity
• Retina Display graphics anomalies on Mix/Control
• 10.6.8 connectivity issues

Am I following?

Thanks,
JC

You're definitely following me :)

Thanks JC.
R

[KristianNielsen]

JC,

My problem - and I see quite a few others having the same - is that when I drag in applications (Live and Reason) to the list of active HUI/Mackie app's, it asks to restart.

When re-opening, the list is all empty. :-/

Would be absolutely fantastic to have this solved!