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#1
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Loudness Meter - different readings
I just did a comparison of
NUGEN LM Correct TC Electronic lm2n Izotope RX4 Waves WLM Plus measuring a 83 minute feature in 2.0. While the measuring of integrated loudness and true peak are matching overall, there seems to be some confusion between momentary and short term loudness across those plugins, and loudness range shows different results as well. I attatched screenshots of the results to this post. Does anyone have an explanation for this? Especially for the short term loudness? Several TV stations in Germany have different specs for the max. short term loudness, and it's kind of unsettling that the Nugen measures 4 LU less than the TC for example.
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iMac Pro - MacOS 10.14.6 --- - Pro Tools U HDN 2019.6 - Avid HD Omni + HD I/O 8x8x8 - C|24 | S3 | Dock |
#2
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Re: Loudness Meter - different readings
All of the stations I have dealt with so far(ARD, ZDF, RTL, RTL2, Vox, Kabel1, Sat1, ProSieben, EinsPlus, ZDFNeo, NTV) only cared for the integrated and range values. Everything else was never checked at all.
Though Nugen and GrimmLevelOne measure exactly the same here. |
#3
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Re: Loudness Meter - different readings
While that may be true I still like to meet the specs required with the mixes I deliver.
And in order to do that I have to be able to rely on those readings, which I obviously cannot. Or am I the only one experiencing discrepancies? So far none of my mixes for ZDF, Arte and NBC have been rejected either, and I used Nugen for those. So I'll stick to it I guess, even though I like TC and Izotope better.
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iMac Pro - MacOS 10.14.6 --- - Pro Tools U HDN 2019.6 - Avid HD Omni + HD I/O 8x8x8 - C|24 | S3 | Dock |
#4
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Re: Loudness Meter - different readings
Yeah, I think that the short term is there to help you, rather than be part of a delivery specification. Certainly here in the UK they seem more concerned with the integrated and range measurements.
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Pro Tools Utimate 2018.7, on - i7 5820k 6 x 4GHz (12 threads), 16GB DDR4, Win 10 Pro, BM Mini Monitor PCIe, GTX 660Ti 2GB; Dell Laptop, i7 4x3.6GHz (8 threads ), 16GB DDR4, Win 10 Pro, GTX1060MaxQ 6GB; "Plan B" - i7 6700k, 4 x 3.4GHz, 16GB DDR4, Sierra, AJA Kona LHi, GTX 1050Ti 4GB. RME FireFace802 + ARC, RME Babyface Avid D-Command, Artist Control, V-Control, Korg MicroKontrol 7.1.2 Presonus Monitors |
#5
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Re: Loudness Meter - different readings
And by the way, PPMUlator XL is often overlooked - it does EBU R128 and ATSC loudness, despite having a misleading product name. Good value for money as well.
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Pro Tools Utimate 2018.7, on - i7 5820k 6 x 4GHz (12 threads), 16GB DDR4, Win 10 Pro, BM Mini Monitor PCIe, GTX 660Ti 2GB; Dell Laptop, i7 4x3.6GHz (8 threads ), 16GB DDR4, Win 10 Pro, GTX1060MaxQ 6GB; "Plan B" - i7 6700k, 4 x 3.4GHz, 16GB DDR4, Sierra, AJA Kona LHi, GTX 1050Ti 4GB. RME FireFace802 + ARC, RME Babyface Avid D-Command, Artist Control, V-Control, Korg MicroKontrol 7.1.2 Presonus Monitors |
#6
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Re: Loudness Meter - different readings
I am pretty shire this is true for germany as well. Everytime I asked if I have to meet the Short Term Specs which normally doesn't help the dynamics of the program I was told that the short term is only for commercials and does not apply for the long programmparts, but that might be different for Arte.
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#7
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Re: Loudness Meter - different readings
I don't have a solid technical explanation, perhaps someone who knows more will chime in.
But... Quote:
If not, then, why do you care?
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#8
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Re: Loudness Meter - different readings
If the station has a requirement for a maximum short term loudness, that would then start to limit the loudness range, which could make the programme both dull to listen to, and possibly not a wide enough loudness range for other broadcasters. Seems strange also that they'd be deviating from the R128 spec.
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Pro Tools Utimate 2018.7, on - i7 5820k 6 x 4GHz (12 threads), 16GB DDR4, Win 10 Pro, BM Mini Monitor PCIe, GTX 660Ti 2GB; Dell Laptop, i7 4x3.6GHz (8 threads ), 16GB DDR4, Win 10 Pro, GTX1060MaxQ 6GB; "Plan B" - i7 6700k, 4 x 3.4GHz, 16GB DDR4, Sierra, AJA Kona LHi, GTX 1050Ti 4GB. RME FireFace802 + ARC, RME Babyface Avid D-Command, Artist Control, V-Control, Korg MicroKontrol 7.1.2 Presonus Monitors |
#9
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Re: Loudness Meter - different readings
Because a calibrated and compliant meter should measure the same values as a different one, that is calibrated and compliant to the same standard.
LRA readings are different as well. Not by much, though. But still I find that to be a little strange.
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iMac Pro - MacOS 10.14.6 --- - Pro Tools U HDN 2019.6 - Avid HD Omni + HD I/O 8x8x8 - C|24 | S3 | Dock |
#10
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Re: Loudness Meter - different readings
You can get different readings with successive analysis of the same piece, using the same software, let alone multiple brands.
This is one of the reasons there is a tolerance built into most delivery specs.
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Pro Tools Utimate 2018.7, on - i7 5820k 6 x 4GHz (12 threads), 16GB DDR4, Win 10 Pro, BM Mini Monitor PCIe, GTX 660Ti 2GB; Dell Laptop, i7 4x3.6GHz (8 threads ), 16GB DDR4, Win 10 Pro, GTX1060MaxQ 6GB; "Plan B" - i7 6700k, 4 x 3.4GHz, 16GB DDR4, Sierra, AJA Kona LHi, GTX 1050Ti 4GB. RME FireFace802 + ARC, RME Babyface Avid D-Command, Artist Control, V-Control, Korg MicroKontrol 7.1.2 Presonus Monitors |
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