How Is Sample Rounding STILL A THING

[innesireinar]

Originally Posted by take77

I've discovered I can't use the cut/insert time function either because of this.
At least not with a project of varying tempos.
It results in the misalignment of every single clip (both audio & MIDI), every MIDI note pattern & marker placement.

Last night, I went to cut the intro section of my project to shorten the length of the track; to start the shorter version from Bar 1.
Should have been quick & easy.

Before doing so, I made a backup file because I knew this might happen from previous experience.
But wanted to see if I could do it because I wanted to cut the intro section.
Should have taken less than a minute to perform this task.
Instead, I had to re-align EVERY single audio & midi clip along with every single marker.
Everything was shifted just under a 64th note off the start of each measure.

I got halfway through sliding everything back onto the grid and gave up.
Then reopened the saved session and now just start the song 16 bars in.
Just not worth the hassle of cutting on my PT 2019 system. I can use my PT11 laptop for the task later.

Anyhow, I'm not sure if this would happen if the song was all one tempo but at least I know to use PT 11 on my laptop to do any kind of cuts or insertions.
As well as any other MIDI pattern creation or arranging.

Yes, this happens on songs at one tempo as well

[take77]

Thanks for the confirmation.

"Unbelievable..." My thoughts exactly.

[foxes]

I think the layered editing function may have something to do with this ridiculous bug / bad coding. PT11 did not have these issues and LE was implemented in PT12. The shadow that is meant to show when clips are layered randomly appears all over the place in a song arrangement where no layering is taking place.

[Stephen Bond]

Originally Posted by NateAlexander

I cannot believe this is still an issue in Pro Tools.

For anyone who doesn't know what I'm talking about, it's a long-standing issue where Pro Tools (doesn't happen in ANY OTHER DAW) fails to properly accommodate pasting of audio to the grid of certain sample lengths against certain tempos. Essentially what happens is you will duplicate a clip a few times and eventually it will just be off grid-- and no it has nothing to do with no selecting a whole grid's worth of a region or anything basic like that.

So the question is how has this not been addressed? What happens at Avid Connect every year that nobody complains about this HUGE insane issue?

A lot of this pain can be alleviated by using the Loop Tool (at the bottom under Standard and TCE) rather than the duplicate or repeat commands.

I switched to it a few years back and haven't looked back.

Now if I could only find some solution for my MIDI clips

Stephen

[capt kirk]

This is a basic issue, which proves they have no one in the programming dept(wherever that is) who understands modern music production, and does it on a regular professional basis. You can have all the fancy schmancy endorsee's in the world, but if you dont have someone who actually UNDERSTANDS how and why, standing there doing tests with the programmers, you're NEVER gonna get it. Hence 10 years of the same bug, never being fixed. If one of those programmers had to work in music production itd be fixed in 3 milliseconds. In Avid's defence, Ive never seen any company operate any differently.

[midnightrambler]

Originally Posted by JFreak

MIDI is never sample accurate. Data rate being 31250 bits per second it does not match any audio sampling rate at any DAW.

This is not a good enough excuse. There is simply no point having a "ticks" mode but if it doesn't place the clips on the grid at the same point consistently.

Also, there are still people on this forum who don't really believe this bug exists - that's it's purely "user error" - so to that end I've managed to create a recipe to people to try out and hopefully prove it once and for all. Video example : https://youtu.be/UvOm-LQq3jU
1. New session
2. Set tempo = 162.8748, Time sig=7/8
3. Create a MIDI track
4. Create a blank MIDI clip, say 64 bars
4. Now select a random 4 bar selection - I used 41|1|447 - and trim the clip
5. Copy this clip backwards to the start using control-alt-cmd click
6. Now select the original clip and duplicate forward. At bar 381 you will find that the clip has slipped from |447 ticks to |446 ticks, *despite* the MIDI track being in ticks mode.

Now you could argue that the numbers are a bit random on this example*, or that in reality you wouldn't copy it that many times, or that some sort of rounding is bound to occur somewhere, but for me that's by the by. The simple fact is, the clip should *always* start at the same point in the bar in ticks mode - that's what it's for! - and it just doesn't.

(*Not that random actually, they're based on a session I'm mixing)

[innesireinar]

Originally Posted by midnightrambler

This is not a good enough excuse. There is simply no point having a "ticks" mode but if it doesn't place the clips on the grid at the same point consistently.

Also, there are still people on this forum who don't really believe this bug exists - that's it's purely "user error" - so to that end I've managed to create a recipe to people to try out and hopefully prove it once and for all. Video example : https://youtu.be/UvOm-LQq3jU
1. New session
2. Set tempo = 162.8748, Time sig=7/8
3. Create a MIDI track
4. Create a blank MIDI clip, say 64 bars
4. Now select a random 4 bar selection - I used 41|1|447 - and trim the clip
5. Copy this clip backwards to the start using control-alt-cmd click
6. Now select the original clip and duplicate forward. At bar 381 you will find that the clip has slipped from |447 ticks to |446 ticks, *despite* the MIDI track being in ticks mode.

Now you could argue that the numbers are a bit random on this example*, or that in reality you wouldn't copy it that many times, or that some sort of rounding is bound to occur somewhere, but for me that's by the by. The simple fact is, the clip should *always* start at the same point in the bar in ticks mode - that's what it's for! - and it just doesn't.

(*Not that random actually, they're based on a session I'm mixing)

I know this very well...
For those who don't believe this bug exists, why on pt11 this does not happen?

[JFreak]

Sorry I have never tested tempo of 162 and four decimals. I would just have put in 163


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[midnightrambler]

Originally Posted by JFreak

Sorry I have never tested tempo of 162 and four decimals. I would just have put in 163


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That's still not good enough. I've inherited this mix from an artist who worked in Logic and decided that was the tempo, and if that's the tempo, that's the tempo. If they want to work to 4 decimal places, or want to put joss sticks in the studio, or whatever else they think will get their music over the line, then that's fine by me.

[JFreak]

Point being I have not been affected/bothered by this.. not saying it is not a bug, just haven't found it