Keeping Venue consoles current

[Tim Woodworth]

This may be more a question for someone at Digidesign.

From my understanding the 2.9 upgrade is a two part upgrade, 1 - The OS, and 2 - The Venue application software,... Will we need to make the jump to 2.9 in order to continue to download free upgrades in the future? It seems that this is true since you may now be working under a new OS system.

Also just my .02 worth: Digidesign products are the only products in my inventory that requires me to pay for any type of software upgrade. I am not only talking about audio consoles, but lighting consoles, controllers, amps, moving fixtures, and some manufacturers offer updates far after the product is current. I think this policy should be re-evaluated.

To have customers that purchased desks that are still your current models, required to pay to keep them up to date only increases the likelyhood that there will be different software versions of your products across the world, thus making it more difficult for the user. I would think as the manufacturer you would want all your products out there to be current and the same. This policy only makes that very un-likely

I read that one of the reasons you don't offer this as a downloadable update was due to the upgrade of the OS system. Maybe you could look into how wholehog lighting consoles offer their upgrades. They have you download an ISO image after you enter your consoles serial #. Maybe that won't work for your situation, but it is just an idea.

[Jason Stygar]

We haven't updated our consoles yet, but I know our 2.8.5 update was back-ordered a month or two when we ordered it... Which just seems absolutely silly.

It's a software update. I could've mailed my own CD-R and had it returned if that would've made it easier...

The upgrade process could certainly be improved...

[Kenmillerjr]

Tim-

Although I am not a Digi rep, maybe I can add some two-cents in. One of the main reasons if I can assume here that Digi charges for their major upgrades is that it keeps the software moving forward. It is the same with most software upgrades I'm aware of...ProTools, Mac OSX or even Windows. The minor upgrades are free, but they charge for the major software revisions. Even Yamaha has done this with some of the OS' for some of their desks in the past. I don't mind paying for them.

The beautiful thing with the VENUE series of consoles in say...a showfile created under version 2.8.1 will open and function on a desk that has 2.9; and vise-versa. Although, I do believe that AVID should allow you to purchase an upgrade kit and download it from their site, such as is done with ProTools. There is a reason they do not allow the major updates to be downloaded, but I do not recall why.

[Sheldon Radford]

Hi guys,

Lots of good points here. Let me see if I can sum them up with a few answers...

What's the difference between a paid upgrade and a free update?
A paid upgrade typically has a number of new features to it, and is distributed as a physical CD, along with the required OS (which often also contains some updates). A free update is considered a "minor" software version, and typically only addresses bug fixes or support for new hardware. These releases only contain the application code, not the OS.

Why can't I download a software upgrade?
Until just recently, the terms of the OS license prevented us from doing this. Any release containing the OS had to be distributed on physical media. We've been working hard to change this, and should be able to distribute paid upgrades as downloads in the future.

Why charge for upgrades?
Software has value. It takes a team of developer and testers months to put out a new release, and some of this investment must be realized. The price for a software upgrade is quite reasonable relative to the new functionality it provides.

All in all I agree the upgrade process can be improved. We're working towards this, including adding some new features to the Avid webstore to better facilitate download options. In the meantime, thanks for sticking with us and being patient.

Sheldon

[Jason Stygar]

Sheldon,

I see what you mean by OS... When others said that, it slipped past me that it was referring to the embedded Windows OS... And if you have to redistribute that entirely, then I see that the licensing might have stipulations...

Makes perfect sense... (Can't say I understand the backorder still, but I get the dowloading)...

Look forward to downloads in the future (which presumably would cure the backorder issue as well)...


Thanks for the comprehensive answer!

Jason

[Tim Woodworth]

Well, it sounds like you may soon be able to download all updates. I think it can be done even with OS system updates. Like I stated before...wholehog lighting consoles have Windows XP operating systems and they allow you to download updates for the OS by getting it in an ISO image file format.

Ken I am not aware of what Yamaha product you would be refering to. I have M7cls, PM5ds, and have never had to pay for any updates. And that has taken the desks from version 1 to 2 and with the M7...to version 3. Maybe some of their desks prior to that they charged for.

I just think it is unfortunate for someone that purchased any of the Venue desks a few months ago (Before Sept 2010), be required to pay more to keep their desks current. I understand the concept that you are paying a small price to make your desk "new" again, and maybe desk surfaces will have a longer life span than in years past with analog if we just keep updating the software, but I think that costs that need to be recovered for the development of better features in the software come from the selling of product from here forward, not from here forward....and backward.

[Limelight]

I agree with not charging. Look at Apple for instance. When they come out with new versions of iTunes, iPhone software, iPad software, you simply download the upgrade an install it. No price no hassle. That's a big reason why I bought my Avid desk to begin with, that it never will be outdated or behind the curve because you could update the software.

That being said, what about service plans that include free software updates. Depending on the level of plan you are, u get free updates. From a company standpoint, to me that makes better since. For the guys who always have mission critical gigs, they'd be on the top tier service plan and updates would be free and never be a problem. Guys like me who use the console 3 times a week for corporate use might choose a lesser plan and then would be required to purchase software upgrades at a discounted price IF we saw benefit from that update.

[Jason Stygar]

When we bought ours we got free updates for a year... Even the paid ones...

I'm beginning to realize (having not been the one to negotiate the actual purchase) that this was probably a service provided by our dealer (who may have been inclined because we bought two systems)...

Perhaps that's something to consider when buying... Negotiate some SW updates in with the dealer... It's certainly worth the extra $150 to them to sell you a $60-120k console...

[Kenmillerjr]

Chris,

I do understand what you are saying. But on a brauder scald, Apple doesn't give main revisions of their software away for free, such as Tiger, Leopard or Snow Leopard. Sure, the updates and patches are free in-between.

[digidesigner]

I have a question that relates to the topic so I'm putting it here instead of doing a new topic. Lets say I own a D-Show ver. X on a CD. So now I travel the world with band X and I get different Venue desks many running older system software. Is it "ok" for me to install new system software on these desks as I would like to use them with the new software for my show?