Does Beat detective suck, or is it me?????????

[sukks2bu]

I cant seem to get this thing to work "WELL" for me. Im on a MIX system V5.1.3 OS9, And when I try to use BD to fix drum tracks, It allways seems to make it worse.

I,ve tried cutting only to the kick trigers, and it doesnt work well, tried cutting to kick and snare, doesnt work well. Always having all the drums grouped in both scenarios.

Can anyone offer the best way to use BD without getting into "I should upgrade to OS 10"

Thanks

[sukks2bu]

Ok, I didnt leave much detail here. Here is the way I've been trying to use it.

1- I already built a grid based on the click track (real audio from drum machine)
2- Select say 8 bars (kick only) and set the start and end time bar 1 beat 1 to bar 9 beat 1 = 8 bars
3- will analyse the audio and set triger points on the kick, make sure they are all proper
4- will group all the drums (kick,snare,toms,over,room etc) and seperate regions
5- conform the seperated regions
6- fill gaps, cross fade if there is clicks
7- listen back, and it sounds totally screwed up, or no better than the original performance.


Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I realy need help before I snap

[Chris Cavell]

...when I try to use BD to fix drum tracks, It allways seems to make it worse...

That's probably your biggest problem right there...trying to "fix" tracks instead of merely enhancing an already pretty good performance.

One thing you can try is speeding up the tempo one BPM or more prior to conforming the regions.

In my opinion, the best method is to treat pro tools like tape...comping in large chunks (8 bars or more) from multiple takes instead of trying to place every single beat perfectly seems to provide me with the best results. Only once I've done this do I consider looking into smaller sections...and even then, I only fix by BD or manually those few overly aggregious areas that absolutely need it.

[Anibal]

it's you...

[Mt.Everest]

Ok, I didnt leave much detail here. Here is the way I've been trying to use it.

1- I already built a grid based on the click track (real audio from drum machine)
2- Select say 8 bars (kick only) and set the start and end time bar 1 beat 1 to bar 9 beat 1 = 8 bars
3- will analyse the audio and set triger points on the kick, make sure they are all proper
4- will group all the drums (kick,snare,toms,over,room etc) and seperate regions
5- conform the seperated regions
6- fill gaps, cross fade if there is clicks
7- listen back, and it sounds totally screwed up, or no better than the original performance.


Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I realy need help before I snap

A few tips:

Watch out for the bug where if you move the sensitivity slider too much to the right, the markers all take one massive jump to the right or left, away from you actual hits. Move the slider up to this point, then back it off a few ticks.

Make sure you choose low emphasis for kicks, and high emphasis for snares when analyzing.

Make sure to use the checkboxes for 'material contains sixteenths or triplets" if thats what you are dealing with.

When doing the crossfades, you MUST ONLY use 'Fill Gaps', then tab to each grouped region, trim it further away from the transient (yes VERY tedious), and THEN do global fades. You are getting clicks cuz BD edits the region very close to the transient. When you fade it, you are getting double hits cuz its fading the moved region into the orignal placement of the old region. THIS is the most tedious thing about BD, and I wish that Digi would allow some kind of region padding option that serves the function of the tab/trim step I go thru. I edited that Reel Drums project, and let me tell you, this took an insane amount of hours to do manually.

BIG TIP: Look at your original drum performance against the grid. Is it all pretty much early? Late? How bad is it? I am a drummer, a rusty one at that, and when I record myself, I am way early to the click. So before I BD it, I shift my whole performance a few notches later, so its generally closer to the grid. If your original performance is so off that it it actually CLOSER to the nearest WRONG 8th noth, BD with pull it to that note, not where you want it. Things have to be generally decent, only a bit sloppy for BD to work. I mean, how can it know if the performance is so bad that there are transients a full 8th note away from the grid, as opposed to purposefully wanting to be there?

Additionally, when players are just really off, I do a little bit of manual editing to get things closer to the grid, then use BD.

Good Luck
MT

[danickstr]

have you looked at ableton live's function for this? i know it is not what you are asking, but in the demo it seemed to work very well. i have no personal exp doing it with either prog, i have always done it the bar by bar method.

[Scott Goldberg]

Quote:
__________________________________________________ __________________________________

That's probably your biggest problem right there...trying to "fix" tracks instead of merely enhancing an already pretty good performance.

__________________________________________________ __________________________________

I'm with Chris, generally I would only use it after only trying to get some decent takes and then comping them into one playlist...and then using beat dtective to tighten it up,. I don't think it's really meant as a cure-alll. Trying to get as musical of a performance as possible, I'm sure you'll agree, is always more preferred, as I'm sure you . Sometimes, even snapping reqions to grid and duplicating can be just as fast and even more successful. To each his own I guess.

[Shawn Simpson]

When doing the crossfades, you MUST ONLY use 'Fill Gaps', then tab to each grouped region, trim it further away from the transient (yes VERY tedious), and THEN do global fades. You are getting clicks cuz BD edits the region very close to the transient. When you fade it, you are getting double hits cuz its fading the moved region into the orignal placement of the old region. THIS is the most tedious thing about BD, and I wish that Digi would allow some kind of region padding option that serves the function of the tab/trim step I go thru.

That's what the "trigger pad" setting will do for you. It allows for a region pad BEFORE the analyzed trigger where the region seperation will occur. That way the newly seperated regions don't all start right on the transient, but have some space in front. It may not be what you're looking for, but it works pretty well for me.

[sukks2bu]

it's you...

I was hoping someone would say this. You must have wonderful experience with BD, so you just became my new best freind.....

If it is me, would you care to share how you get this to work so that it doesnt suck.

[sukks2bu]

That's what the "trigger pad" setting will do for you. It allows for a region pad BEFORE the analyzed trigger where the region seperation will occur. That way the newly seperated regions don't all start right on the transient, but have some space in front. It may not be what you're looking for, but it works pretty well for me.

Care to explain, where is the trigger pad on the BD window?