How long do you Edit a song on average?

[lincol1]

Ok, so not sure but I'm thinking I might be having a complaint from a client and was hoping to get some feedback from some of you that have been doing this longer than me.

Here's my situation, I sent out a bill in November, and it's now being contested. Well I think. They haven't paid, and are asking questions about some of the charges. The charges in question are related to editing in particular. So my question is basically if this seems fair or not. I billed for 16 hours of editing on three songs. This does not include mixing or recording. 16 hours of editing alone. The band gave me a list of items, and some (for me) were a bit tricky and it took two days. Things like tightening entrances, fixing wrong notes, etc...

So, this comes out to a little over 5 hours of editing per song. Is that abnormal? How much time is a good average? To me I didn't blink, hell I've spent 5 hours trying to get a good drum sound - not something I want to brag about but I have. I've spent 5 hours trying to get any number of things fixed. So, to me, doesn't seem too abnormal, but I need objectivity. My worst fear is that I'm taking too long on things, and clients expect faster results - faster engineers!

I guess I tend to get pretty wrapped up in the music of my clients and always want it to sound it's best - Perfectionist? Maybe, is that bad?

Looking forward to the voices of experience and reason.

[Stig Eliassen]

Originally Posted by lincol1

Ok, so not sure but I'm thinking I might be having a complaint from a client and was hoping to get some feedback from some of you that have been doing this longer than me.

Here's my situation, I sent out a bill in November, and it's now being contested. Well I think. They haven't paid, and are asking questions about some of the charges. The charges in question are related to editing in particular. So my question is basically if this seems fair or not. I billed for 16 hours of editing on three songs. This does not include mixing or recording. 16 hours of editing alone. The band gave me a list of items, and some (for me) were a bit tricky and it took two days. Things like tightening entrances, fixing wrong notes, etc...

So, this comes out to a little over 5 hours of editing per song. Is that abnormal? How much time is a good average? To me I didn't blink, hell I've spent 5 hours trying to get a good drum sound - not something I want to brag about but I have. I've spent 5 hours trying to get any number of things fixed. So, to me, doesn't seem too abnormal, but I need objectivity. My worst fear is that I'm taking too long on things, and clients expect faster results - faster engineers!

I guess I tend to get pretty wrapped up in the music of my clients and always want it to sound it's best - Perfectionist? Maybe, is that bad?

Looking forward to the voices of experience and reason.

Doesn't sound abnormal to me. It really depends on how bad the musicians have played, how pitchy the vocals are, how well is it recorded, etc. And, do the clients expect stellar results from a mediocre performance?

I've spent two days editing two songs where they were forced by the engineer to record to a click, and obviously, they couldn't do it. The timing was absolutely horrible, and I spent a lot of time with elastic audio, Beat Detective and general manual editing. The bassist told me that he got scared when he suddenly couldn't hear the click. I told him "dude, that's because you played in time"

I've spent an hour to re-construct a single word.

I've spent 3-4 hours comping the lead vocal on a single song.

It varies a lot how much editing is needed. But from what you've said, I think you're doing just fine.

[lincol1]

Thanks. Yeah I can't blame anything on the band they are great, but, they recorded live, thinking they could save money and I don't think they realized those edits would take me so long. Frankly, I didn't either.


Appreciate the feedback man.

[lincol1]

bump

[albee1952]

I'm with PT Lover here. I often will spend that much time(we seem to have less talent at work with many acts these days). The real question is; will this project generate more business? If yes, than maybe offer a break and move forward. If not, shoot for the entire bill as that act won't be back Tough call either way, but I tend to discount a bit on a full CD project. The end result has my name on it too

[lincol1]

Thanks Albee, I was hoping you'd chime in. funny you mention cutting them a break, the sixteen hours was the break, I guess I didn't make that too clear, but I've spent more time than that, but didn't feel right charging for my learning curve with things like elastic audio etc... Not to mention we got ADC half way through the project and I needed to un-nudge regions etc...

Anyhow, I just got off the phone and it turns out they are not disputing, they are happy with my work. They just need money. I think that's a while different problem though...

Still interested in others thoughts though...

[Top Jimmy]

Originally Posted by lincol1

the sixteen hours was the break, I guess I didn't make that too clear, but I've spent more time than that, but didn't feel right charging for my learning curve with things like elastic audio etc...

Then these hours should show up on the invoice even if you decide to credit or discount them. The client should know the reality of what it took in terms of time to accomplish what they wanted.

As far as the editing goes, I've spent this kind of time also on bands that don't get it and don't spend their time well before coming into the studio. Comping and tuning lead vocals, tuning and timing harmonies. Timing ins, outs and sustains on instruments. It all adds up. Our job would be easier and certainly more pleasant if they would just do it right from the beginning.

[lincol1]

Very helpful Jimmy!

[QuikDraw]

Originally Posted by Top Jimmy

...As far as the editing goes, I've spent this kind of time also on bands that don't get it and don't spend their time well before coming into the studio. Comping and tuning lead vocals, tuning and timing harmonies. Timing ins, outs and sustains on instruments. It all adds up. Our job would be easier and certainly more pleasant if they would just do it right from the beginning.

Many great recordings were done in the analog days when none of these techniques were an option except comping. It used to be about great musicians recording great performances. Now it's about the musicians getting it close and letting technology and engineering talent make it sound great. Times have changed!

[albee1952]

Originally Posted by lincol1

Thanks Albee, I was hoping you'd chime in. funny you mention cutting them a break, the sixteen hours was the break, I guess I didn't make that too clear, but I've spent more time than that, but didn't feel right charging for my learning curve with things like elastic audio etc... Not to mention we got ADC half way through the project and I needed to un-nudge regions etc...

Anyhow, I just got off the phone and it turns out they are not disputing, they are happy with my work. They just need money. I think that's a while different problem though...

Still interested in others thoughts though...

Pretty gutsy there I would never have upgraded in the middle of a project(okay, not exactly true, but I would have done the upgrade to a new/fresh system drive so I could keep running the old system to finish, and you could have turned ADC off if you already had things nudged). In any case, I feel your pain. Money is so tight here that clients make a squeaking sound when they come thru the door