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  #1  
Old 10-04-2017, 01:38 PM
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DonaldM DonaldM is offline
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Default Switching Sample rates still causes havoc

I wish I could understand why the simple act of changing sample rates causes so many problems. I have a Focusrite 8i6 and I can use the Mix Control program that comes with it to change the sample rate. In this case I needed to close a session I was working on 44.1k to open one in 48k for video. Typically that means, closing the 44.1k session, then exiting PT altogether, change sample rate in MixControl to 48k, re-open Pro Tools, then open the new session in 48k. Rinse and repeat to go back to 44.1k.

Well, going to the 48k session worked fine. But, repeating the same steps to go back to 44.1k has done nothing but cause all kinds of hangups with PT. The session opens, but won't play. So, I try to shut it down, and the close window goes track by track as the little green bar moves millimeter by millimeter. What the heck? Its been over 15 min and the session still hasn't shut down. I'm afraid if just shut down PT I'll mess something up worse.

What I don't understand is why is changing sample rates such a fiasco? It's always been like this, where you've got jump through hoops to change sample rates. Either I'm doing something incorrectly, or PT does not handle this very well. I know others have had the same issue with various interfaces, including Focusrites, among others.

What's the deal??n
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Old 10-04-2017, 04:36 PM
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DonaldM DonaldM is offline
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Default Re: Switching Sample rates still causes havoc

Well, this is turning into another nightmare. Now, I can't get any sessions to work. And I'm up against a hard deadline to complete a project for a client by tomorrow morning.

If I set the MixControl to 44.1k, THEN open Pro Tools, and the session at 44.1k...no joy. Same if try a 48k session using the same procedure.

My original sin was to close a session in 44.1k, then close PT, switch rate on MixControl to 48, re-open PT, then open the new session I had in 48k. No joy.

I've rebooted the PC at least 3 times. No joy.

I'm at a loss what to do. All worked fine until I tried to do the simple thing of switching sample rates between sessions.

Any suggestions on what to try now? I need to get up and running fast!

Thanks
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Old 10-04-2017, 04:54 PM
Darryl Ramm Darryl Ramm is offline
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Default Switching Sample rates still causes havoc

I used to think Focusrite support was pretty good. I would hope they would help you out here, to the point of telling you if you are stuck with known problem behavior or if it’s a Pro Tools is due and which company owns solving it.


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Old 10-04-2017, 05:15 PM
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DonaldM DonaldM is offline
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Default Re: Switching Sample rates still causes havoc

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darryl Ramm View Post
I used to think Focusrite support was pretty good. I would hope they would help you out here, to the point of telling you if you are stuck with known problem behavior or if it’s a Pro Tools is due and which company owns solving it.


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Darryl, Focusrite support is good, and they've helped with other stuff in the recent past. On this issue, the short version is Focusrite says its an Avid issue, and, surprise, Avid says its a Focusrite issue. It wasn't quite that simple, but that was the gist.

Regardless, in my opinion, it IS an Avid issue and here's why. With the release of PT 9, as you well know, Avid made the choice to allow for using PT with 3rd party interfaces. You well recall how we all jumped on that. Until 9.0 we were all using one Avid interface or the other. Now, it seems to me, that if you open up your product to allow for 3rd party interfaces that at the very least that means you will see to it that your software will operate normally for pretty all routine demands. And, I would say that switching sample rates is about as routine as it gets. Yet, here were are in 2017 and version 12.7 with 13.0 probably around the corner, and we're still seeing users posting here about this very issue. Its not just Focusrite. I've seen posts here with same problem with other top name interfaces. This should not be.

My buddy up the road has a nice studio and he uses Sonar. I remember about 7 years ago, I was in there to do a mix with him, and the session we had was at 44.1k. He had just come off a session at 48k and forget to switch his interface for our session. With our session open, he just reached around the back of his interface, flipped the switch to 44.1k, and we were off an running. We didn't even have to close the session in Sonar. Now, that was 7 years ago. How hard can this be?

So, no, I think it is very much Avid's problem to solve. They're the ones who made the choice to open Pro Tool's architecture up to allow 3rd party interfaces to be used, so it is incumbent on them to see to it that basic routine functions demanded of an interface work.
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Old 10-04-2017, 05:40 PM
Darryl Ramm Darryl Ramm is offline
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Default Re: Switching Sample rates still causes havoc

As you know I'm not shy about blaming Avid for things, but in this case many other interfaces can handle sample rate changes with Pro Tools without all these issues. Pro Tools is the default market leader. Focusrite should be just fixing their side to make it work, and testing with Pro Tools during development should always have happened. Is there documentation on their site explaining to their customers how to deal with their interfaces with this know issue with that market leading software? I am suspecting you may have a too rosey view of how Focusrite are treating you.

(Not looked into these in detail but a quick Google search makes it look like possible issues with different Focusrite interfaces and not all Pro Tools related).

... a different Scarlett interface when the DAW sample rate change does not work...

https://support.focusrite.com/hc/en-...lett-interface

... A few Focusrite uses having sample rate setting problems with an S1...

http://forumsarchive.presonus.com/posts/list/14630.page

etc.

Focusrite not having their own support forum is another hit against them.

Last edited by Darryl Ramm; 10-04-2017 at 06:01 PM.
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Old 10-04-2017, 06:21 PM
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Default Re: Switching Sample rates still causes havoc

Hey Donald, have you double-checked that Windows is not using the Focusrite as its default playback device? Sometimes a simple OS update will change that setting(it has for me anyway)
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Old 10-04-2017, 06:26 PM
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Default Re: Switching Sample rates still causes havoc

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Originally Posted by albee1952 View Post
Hey Donald, have you double-checked that Windows is not using the Focusrite as its default playback device? Sometimes a simple OS update will change that setting(it has for me anyway)
Yeah, that was the first thing I checked. Nope, that didn't change. (and no, my Focusrite is not my default playback device for the PC)
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Old 10-04-2017, 06:37 PM
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DonaldM DonaldM is offline
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Default Re: Switching Sample rates still causes havoc

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darryl Ramm View Post
As you know I'm not shy about blaming Avid for things, but in this case many other interfaces can handle sample rate changes with Pro Tools without all these issues. Pro Tools is the default market leader. Focusrite should be just fixing their side to make it work, and testing with Pro Tools during development should always have happened. Is there documentation on their site explaining to their customers how to deal with their interfaces with this know issue with that market leading software? I am suspecting you may have a too rosey view of how Focusrite are treating you.

(Not looked into these in detail but a quick Google search makes it look like possible issues with different Focusrite interfaces and not all Pro Tools related).

... a different Scarlett interface when the DAW sample rate change does not work...

https://support.focusrite.com/hc/en-...lett-interface

... A few Focusrite uses having sample rate setting problems with an S1...

http://forumsarchive.presonus.com/posts/list/14630.page

etc.

Focusrite not having their own support forum is another hit against them.
Thanks, Darryl. I hadn't seen these particular sites, but I have read and/or looked at a bunch of others. We've had lengthy discussions on this issue with respect to Focusrite here on the forum.

What's surprised me tonight was that I have done many sample rate switches in the recent past with little problem, once I figured out the basic dance. Its really just close PT, re-set sample rate on the Focusrite using the MixControl software, then re-open PT, and then open or create the new session at the new rate. Rinse and repeat. That dance has worked fine for quite a while...until tonight. For the life of me, I have NO idea what has changed. I have not upgraded either PT or any drivers for Focusrite in quite a while, and have done sample rate changes frequently over the past several months.

The only new software I've added are AAX plugins.

I suppose its possible a Windows 10 update might have changed something...but I have no idea what or even what to look for with respect to this. All the obvious things look correct to me. And maybe you can explain why it is these things ALWAYS happen when you're up on a hard deadline?
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Old 10-04-2017, 06:41 PM
Darryl Ramm Darryl Ramm is offline
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Default Re: Switching Sample rates still causes havoc

That change in behavior I'd be going back to Focusrite support to check in with.

(I suspect those links are not relevant, but were more a comment that lots of discussion out there, as you know.).
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Old 10-05-2017, 09:03 AM
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Default Re: Switching Sample rates still causes havoc

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darryl Ramm View Post
That change in behavior I'd be going back to Focusrite support to check in with.

(I suspect those links are not relevant, but were more a comment that lots of discussion out there, as you know.).
Yes, I am going to give them a call. Thankfully, when I booted up everything this morning, I was able to finish up the project. Whew!!

I noticed last night that in a lengthy discussion on this issue in the 3rd Party Interfaces forum on here, that *I* was the one who came up with the solution. I had forgotten that! And others who followed my process (as I described earlier in this thread) said it worked. Go figure!
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