Avid Pro Audio Community

Avid Pro Audio Community

How to Join & Post  •  Community Terms of Use  •  Help Us Help You

Knowledge Base Search  •  Community Search  •  Learn & Support


Avid Home Page

Go Back   Avid Pro Audio Community > Legacy Products > Pro Tools 12

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #11  
Old 05-10-2016, 02:52 PM
Prabha Prabha is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Santiago, Chile
Posts: 94
Default Re: Fix & Unify Windows Decorations on Windows 7, 8, 10+

Quote:
Originally Posted by CygnusX-1Bk2 View Post
Good luck with that. This is why I won't use ProTools on Windows unless I absolutely have to. That and all of the problems Windows users are having. And Windows is a terrible operating system, especially since XP. But that's just me.
I disagree too! I've been using PT since version 10 on windows and the only serious bug I've had, is the click producing AAE error on 12.5.
That and reading the amount of issues Mac users post in this forum! also is unbelievable all the stuff that becomes obsolete every time apple updates the OS.

But since we are talking religion here, I promise to shut up now.
__________________
PC i56600K 3.5Ghz 16Gb ram
Win 7 64
SSL MX4
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 05-10-2016, 03:50 PM
AvidProToolsUser's Avatar
AvidProToolsUser AvidProToolsUser is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: New York
Posts: 87
Default Re: Fix & Unify Windows Decorations on Windows 7, 8, 10+

Everyone is completely missing the point.
Windows Decorations vs Windows Composition and its affect on performance.

Window decoration and composition are Two very different things.

Windows decoration: (Titlebar, close, maximize, resize, roll-up)
JuanPC doesn't realize they have made windows decorations lighter with win10 than previous versions. No borders, no 3D buttons, no border change during animation(just color), no 3D button change on click etc. -- These choices are less taxing on the system...if they even are taxing in general.

Windows composition: (Shadows, blur, animation, scaling, rotation)
Windows compositions are arguable the same as far as system taxation. Maybe I'll post a comprehensive comparison.
If one wants to disable windows composition by all means go a head.

Basically, if you are interested in unification of the modern GUI we paid for +1, else ignore post. Thanks.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 05-10-2016, 03:57 PM
JuanPC JuanPC is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Miami FL
Posts: 600
Default Re: Fix & Unify Windows Decorations on Windows 7, 8, 10+

You complain that ProTools System usage [x] does not look the same as ProTools Exit [X]

You blame ProTools...
You ask AViD to fix that...

But they look the same in Windows7
That means is not ProTools, is Windows 10.

That's what I see.


You can download Windows Themes & Skins, Transformation packs, search google.
There's a skin that emulates OSX exactly in Windows7.
www.thememypc.com
__________________
--->If you don't like what i wrote:
Click: JuanPC
Click: View Public Profile
Click: User lists^
Click: Add to ignore list.
Solved.

Last edited by JuanPC; 05-10-2016 at 04:13 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 05-10-2016, 04:13 PM
AvidProToolsUser's Avatar
AvidProToolsUser AvidProToolsUser is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: New York
Posts: 87
Default Re: Fix & Unify Windows Decorations on Windows 7, 8, 10+

Quote:
Originally Posted by JuanPC View Post
You complain that ProTools System usage [x] does not look the same as ProTools Exit [X]

You blame ProTools...
You ask AViD to fix that...

But they look the same in Windows7
That means is not ProTools, is Windows 10.

That's what I've read.


You can download Windows Themes & Skins, search google.
Actually it means that Avid is using legacy code. Let us forget the composition and decoration.

If Avid is using a ton of legacy code in its design it will impact all of its users.
The more they keep the codebase updated as far as the GUI and general coding, the more it will help alleviate spaghetti-code and bloat.
Modernizing the decoration will also impact their c++ classes and keep them inline with MS Windows.
Microsoft is smart with WINAPI and other APIs...they usually create new classes in their code that often times are less bloated but are still backwards compatible.

You seem to misunderstand its true impact on the design of PT.
Suggesting to download skins would hurt system performance...Skins have these characteristics:
1. Run as a service
2. Alter registry
3. Constantly redraw explorer and other shell components
4. Use pngs and ico that have to be redrawn

They will adversely impact a system you choose to have Windows 95-like decoration on.

Last edited by AvidProToolsUser; 05-10-2016 at 04:38 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 05-11-2016, 07:47 AM
hooksound hooksound is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: N/A
Posts: 240
Default Re: Fix & Unify Windows Decorations on Windows 7, 8, 10+

My first encounter with PT (8 LE) was at a course, where they had both MACs and PCs and one of the first things that stroke me was the total lack of PT GUI consistency across the platforms. It looks like PT is developed on MACs and then ported to PC afterwards "because it has to". One thing is aesthetics, another thing is readability:

http://protools.ideascale.com/a/dtd/...on/217156-3779

Point is that this inconsistency has been an issue for some time already. E.g. try to open a plug-in window and a send window in PT10 on Windows 7 and have them sit beside each other. There you also see a difference in frame colour and thickness. I must agree with the OP that it has now gotten even worse and PT 12 is indeed not pretty in Windows 10.
__________________
Pro Tools 10.3.10, Cubase Artist 7.5.40, Allen & Heath Qu-16, Focusrite Scarlett 18i8 2G, Fujitsu Lifebook AH532, Intel Core i7-3612QM, 8 GB RAM, Windows 7 Professional SP1 64 bit
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 05-11-2016, 08:22 AM
AvidProToolsUser's Avatar
AvidProToolsUser AvidProToolsUser is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: New York
Posts: 87
Default Re: Fix & Unify Windows Decorations on Windows 7, 8, 10+

Quote:
Originally Posted by hooksound View Post
My first encounter with PT (8 LE) was at a course, where they had both MACs and PCs and one of the first things that stroke me was the total lack of PT GUI consistency across the platforms. It looks like PT is developed on MACs and then ported to PC afterwards "because it has to". One thing is aesthetics, another thing is readability:

http://protools.ideascale.com/a/dtd/...on/217156-3779

Point is that this inconsistency has been an issue for some time already. E.g. try to open a plug-in window and a send window in PT10 on Windows 7 and have them sit beside each other. There you also see a difference in frame colour and thickness. I must agree with the OP that it has now gotten even worse and PT 12 is indeed not pretty in Windows 10.
Well unfortunately one of these issues with readability is a MS Windows fault. I use mactype to render fonts on Windows (https://github.com/Klaudit/mactype/releases).
Avid is not completely at fault with this -- although there are ways they could render fonts to clear it up.

Here are before and after so you can see the stark differences:







If anyone is interested in a configuration file for mactype PM me.
Also, after writing this post-- I decided to start programming a solution to fix these issues. Will keep you guys updated. But I hope before I finish AVID will beat me to it.
Attached Images
File Type: png before-01.png (5.8 KB, 0 views)
File Type: png after-01.png (13.6 KB, 0 views)
File Type: png before-02.png (8.4 KB, 0 views)
File Type: png after-02.png (10.3 KB, 0 views)
File Type: png text-sample.png (27.6 KB, 0 views)
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 05-11-2016, 09:26 AM
hooksound hooksound is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: N/A
Posts: 240
Default Re: Fix & Unify Windows Decorations on Windows 7, 8, 10+

Thanks AvidProToolsUser. This is very interesting.

I guess any proud software developer would strive for platform consistency. I seem to recall that one method is to embed fonts and other resources (e.g. bitmaps) in the app itself in stead of using stock resources.

One can only guess how the PT code base is structured, but it seems to rely quite heavily on the ever changing styles of the Windows API Common Controls etc.
__________________
Pro Tools 10.3.10, Cubase Artist 7.5.40, Allen & Heath Qu-16, Focusrite Scarlett 18i8 2G, Fujitsu Lifebook AH532, Intel Core i7-3612QM, 8 GB RAM, Windows 7 Professional SP1 64 bit
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 05-11-2016, 09:27 AM
JuanPC JuanPC is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Miami FL
Posts: 600
Default Re: Fix & Unify Windows Decorations on Windows 7, 8, 10+

Quote:
Originally Posted by AvidProToolsUser View Post
Suggesting to download skins would hurt system performance...Skins have these characteristics:
1. Run as a service
2. Alter registry
3. Constantly redraw explorer and other shell components
4. Use pngs and ico that have to be redrawn

They will adversely impact a system you choose to have Windows 95-like decoration on.
your own words:
Quote:
Originally Posted by AvidProToolsUser View Post
Believe it or not but PT can handle the window decorations perfectly.
Most PT power users are working with 4+ cores, 8+ GB RAM.
Visualization details are virtually insignificant to the performance of PT.

But as far as just windowing--min, max, close. This should be visually consistent. It is on MAC and has been for a long time.
note: Also if you disable all that you said above(Performance Options)...it will not change window decorations on WIN10.
__________________
--->If you don't like what i wrote:
Click: JuanPC
Click: View Public Profile
Click: User lists^
Click: Add to ignore list.
Solved.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 05-11-2016, 09:29 AM
JuanPC JuanPC is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Miami FL
Posts: 600
Default Re: Fix & Unify Windows Decorations on Windows 7, 8, 10+

Quote:
Originally Posted by hooksound View Post
It looks like PT is developed on MACs and then ported to PC afterwards "because it has to".
except the Noise Blast. LOL Jajajajajajajaja
__________________
--->If you don't like what i wrote:
Click: JuanPC
Click: View Public Profile
Click: User lists^
Click: Add to ignore list.
Solved.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 05-11-2016, 09:30 AM
AvidProToolsUser's Avatar
AvidProToolsUser AvidProToolsUser is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: New York
Posts: 87
Default Re: Fix & Unify Windows Decorations on Windows 7, 8, 10+

Quote:
Originally Posted by hooksound View Post
Thanks AvidProToolsUser. This is very interesting.

I guess any proud software developer would strive for platform consistency. I seem to recall that one method is to embed fonts and other resources (e.g. bitmaps) in the app itself in stead of using stock resources.

One can only guess how the PT code base is structured, but it seems to rely quite heavily on the ever changing styles of the Windows API Common Controls etc.
Yes one can render fonts cross platform and tune. And my belief is when you create an application such as ProTools -- consistency is important. Often when one creates a DAW -- you end up creating an internal GUI toolkit.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Audio glitches with Fast Track Ultra on Windows 10 after updating Windows 10 GregS FireWire and USB Audio Interfaces (Win) 6 12-25-2015 04:40 PM
PT 9 and Windows 7 major CPU spike fix!! PT 9 bug, with fix. Every Windows user!! Will The Weirdo Windows 4 01-19-2011 01:37 PM
Windows Guide - Windows 7 Optimizations and Troubleshooting.[349411] cwsand 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Win) 9 08-12-2010 02:46 PM
Is standalone Windows Audio Drivers v8.0.3 compatible with WINDOWS XP 64 ? VonHelvete 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Win) 6 03-28-2010 11:01 AM
Windows server 2003+windows resource manager. odysseys 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Win) 1 06-20-2003 11:02 AM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:04 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Limited. Forum Hosted By: URLJet.com