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  #11  
Old 05-14-2008, 03:46 PM
BaileyBass BaileyBass is offline
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Default Re: Insert Issues - Use Pre I/O or 96 I/O?????

Quote:
Of course it does, that's the whole point of ADC.

When inserting analog gear, PT will compensate for the D/A and A/D, which of course is all the latency there is. If you are inserting digital gear, PT can't know any delays there and that's what those boxes are for.
Page 70 in the 7.4 manual..I interpreted/read it to mean, and always thought, that it referred to any hardware insert. I don't mind being wrong, as long as I get it right... eventually. SB
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  #12  
Old 05-14-2008, 09:50 PM
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jeff markham jeff markham is offline
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Default Re: Insert Issues - Use Pre I/O or 96 I/O?????

Quote:
Of course it does, that's the whole point of ADC.

When inserting analog gear, PT will compensate for the D/A and A/D, which of course is all the latency there is. If you are inserting digital gear, PT can't know any delays there and that's what those boxes are for.
I should have been more clear ...

Yes, if you have PDC enabled and you enter the correct latency into the Setup->I/O->HW Insert
dialog (per channel), Protools will compensate for the hardware insert delay.

However, Protools is not clairvoyant .. it's doesn't know what the latency in the
hardware insert path is. If you do not enter it correctly into the Setup->I/O->HW Insert
dialog correctly, it will not be able to compensate correctly either.

The PT 7 Reference manual (on or about page 70) discusses a technique to allow you
to determine what the total latency path is from output converters -> hardware and
back is.

jeff
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  #13  
Old 05-14-2008, 09:54 PM
RobMacki RobMacki is offline
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Default Re: Insert Issues - Use Pre I/O or 96 I/O?????

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However, Protools is not clairvoyant ..
I wish there was a clairvoyant plug-in for some of my clients.
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  #14  
Old 05-15-2008, 05:12 AM
Drew Mazurek's Avatar
Drew Mazurek Drew Mazurek is offline
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Default Re: Insert Issues - Use Pre I/O or 96 I/O?????

Quote:

I should have been more clear ...

Yes, if you have PDC enabled and you enter the correct latency into the Setup->I/O->HW Insert
dialog (per channel), Protools will compensate for the hardware insert delay.

However, Protools is not clairvoyant .. it's doesn't know what the latency in the
hardware insert path is. If you do not enter it correctly into the Setup->I/O->HW Insert
dialog correctly, it will not be able to compensate correctly either.

The PT 7 Reference manual (on or about page 70) discusses a technique to allow you
to determine what the total latency path is from output converters -> hardware and
back is.

jeff
Jeff, that's not how it works.

I've never entered anything is those boxes and PT compensates for the D/A A/D round trip. Again, this is the whole point of automatic delay compensation. If you're using analog devices, all you need to do is turn on ADC. Digi knows the latency of its interfaces and compensates based on that. This is why companies like Aurora boast that their box has the same latency as a 192, so PT will work properly with it when using it for inserts.

If it's a digital device (page 70 mentions an effect unit) you can then use that method to measure the inherent delay of the digital device and add that in the box.
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  #15  
Old 05-15-2008, 08:12 PM
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jeff markham jeff markham is offline
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Default Re: Insert Issues - Use Pre I/O or 96 I/O?????

Quote:
Quote:

I should have been more clear ...

Yes, if you have PDC enabled and you enter the correct latency into the Setup->I/O->HW Insert
dialog (per channel), Protools will compensate for the hardware insert delay.

However, Protools is not clairvoyant .. it's doesn't know what the latency in the
hardware insert path is. If you do not enter it correctly into the Setup->I/O->HW Insert
dialog correctly, it will not be able to compensate correctly either.

The PT 7 Reference manual (on or about page 70) discusses a technique to allow you
to determine what the total latency path is from output converters -> hardware and
back is.

jeff
Jeff, that's not how it works.

I've never entered anything is those boxes and PT compensates for the D/A A/D round trip. Again, this is the whole point of automatic delay compensation. If you're using analog devices, all you need to do is turn on ADC. Digi knows the latency of its interfaces and compensates based on that. This is why companies like Aurora boast that their box has the same latency as a 192, so PT will work properly with it when using it for inserts.

If it's a digital device (page 70 mentions an effect unit) you can then use that method to measure the inherent delay of the digital device and add that in the box.

You're right .. it knows about the interface delay ... but if the insert path adds any more delay then it
doesn't. He mentions the Aphex Exciter .. which ( as I recall ) does add a very small amount of
latency.

I've had this come up a couple of times with the interns at our studio. It's a common misconception that
PT will automatically figure out the external latency path if PDC is on .. and it won't..

jeff
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  #16  
Old 05-15-2008, 08:35 PM
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Drew Mazurek Drew Mazurek is offline
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Default Re: Insert Issues - Use Pre I/O or 96 I/O?????

Jeff,
If it's an analog device, the only delay that needs to be compensated for is the D/A and A/D and PT does that automatically.

I can of course come up with a specific device (you mention Aphex, I've never seen one that does) and certainly digital devices that need to use the user definable box, but otherwise it's done for you.

The goal is to make PT behave like a console, inserting a comp or gate or eq and not having to do anything, and it works perfectly for that.

Drew
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