Waves Update Plan - WUP - What’s the point?

[amagras]

For some reason my last comment (5hrs ago) appears after BScout reply to it (3hrs ago). Thank you for taking the time to clarify this for us!

[albee1952]

Just to cloud the issue a bit more, I have several Waves plugins and bundles that all expired at different times and I have yet to pay for WUP in at least 2 years. FWIW, I have recently bought several more singles at different times(gotta love those new sales prices) and on at least 2 occasions, the install has failed. My solution both times was to (using latest Waves Central) uninstall all Waves and then re-install everything over again(including my fresh purchases). Both times, the installer announced to me that several plugins were being updated. Things that make you go "Hmmm"

[JFreak]

Updated WavesHell, that's why. And if you break your computer less than once a year (lose auths) they currently promise to give another set of licenses.

[Andy Gone]

Originally Posted by albee1952

Just to cloud the issue a bit more, I have several Waves plugins and bundles that all expired at different times and I have yet to pay for WUP in at least 2 years. FWIW, I have recently bought several more singles at different times(gotta love those new sales prices) and on at least 2 occasions, the install has failed. My solution both times was to (using latest Waves Central) uninstall all Waves and then re-install everything over again(including my fresh purchases). Both times, the installer announced to me that several plugins were being updated. Things that make you go "Hmmm"

Yes, that's because WavesShell was updated. When you get new plugins that work with the new version of WavesShell, your WavesCentral will inevitably update WavesShell, which means you will need to also update your older plugins to be able to work with this new WavesShell. You don't need WUP to be current to do this.

[Andy Gone]

Originally Posted by Trent W.

I understand WUP is meant for those who have bundles, where a new version of the bundle might include a new plugin, and so the WUP covers the new plugin.

But what’s the point for individual plugins ? I have three or so waves plugins who’s WUP expired in 2015 .. should I be worried about updating the WUP for them?

Their version number is cited as 9.2.0, the same as the plugins I have with a current WUP.

Please help me fill in the gaps .. I feel like I’m missing something.

There is (unfortunately) some confusion always, because Waves have license version and plugin version. 9.2.0 is current license version (this is what you see when you go to your Waves profile and look at your products). Most recent plugin version is 9.92 or something. This you can check if you open a plugin and choose 'About' from the plugin menu.

[noiseboyuk]

Originally Posted by Trent W.

Thanks for digging that out .. so I don't need to worry about WUP until v10.0

Amazing.

Amazing indeed. I've been asking the question of the OP for years, and never found any answer. Even when v10 comes along, I really don't know what the point will be. There might be more new GUIs, but so what?

The even more amazing thing to me is that so many people seem to have, on principle, boycotted Waves because of the WUP "extortion". Apart from (arguably) support, the WUP has done precisely zero for years and thus been entirely benign and redundant, and yet its been this huge ideological block for people. Funny old world.

[TNM]

Originally Posted by Trent W.

I understand WUP is meant for those who have bundles, where a new version of the bundle might include a new plugin, and so the WUP covers the new plugin.

But what’s the point for individual plugins ? I have three or so waves plugins who’s WUP expired in 2015 .. should I be worried about updating the WUP for them?

Their version number is cited as 9.2.0, the same as the plugins I have with a current WUP.

Please help me fill in the gaps .. I feel like I’m missing something.

no point.. i have kept mine up to date for the last 3 years and not received one single thing to show for it.. Nada.. i owned gold bundle and 25 individual licenses.. now i have horizon and a few artist bundles, and the piano and keys.. all wupped, all pointless. It used to be you could sell individual plugins without penalty if wupped but now they want 5% of the RETAIL price as a transfer fee, in other words expensive plugins cost almost as much to transfer as to buy brand new on a sale. I have so many doubled licenses for various reasons, and at the time, transfers for those were free.. I am going to be fighting waves on this, as i never would have done certain upgrades had the new fees been in effect at the time. So not only have i paid for WUP and gotten SFA, i now am stuck with at least 10 licenses i can no longer sell, and i mainly wupped them so i COULD sell them LOL. I mean it's just ridiculous.. This is one of the very reasons why i give waves a hard time publicly these days. They deserve it.

[CygnusX-1Bk2]

The plugins are v 9.2 but the Waveshell is 9.92. No need to update WUP until v10. They've been on V9 for years now. They used to be a little more aggressive with their version updates.

When a new plugin is added to an existing bundle (Abbey Road for instance) do not do the WUP but go to the upgrade section and upgrade the bundle. This will reset your serial numbers and auto update the WUP for that bundle and add the latest plugin to it (though the AR bundle appears as individual plugs in one's account, unlike Gold or Platinum etc.).

[JFreak]

Originally Posted by CygnusX-1Bk2

No need to update WUP until v10. They've been on V9 for years now.

Yea, they should have upped the number to V10 some time ago... of course they say they need some technological breakthrough to warrant a new major version, but lot of us think they are plain and simply greedy. Which I don't understand, because lot of people without WUP are just waiting for V10 to re-WUP, so I guess it's just because they are stupid.

[TNM]

Originally Posted by JFreak

Yea, they should have upped the number to V10 some time ago... of course they say they need some technological breakthrough to warrant a new major version, but lot of us think they are plain and simply greedy. Which I don't understand, because lot of people without WUP are just waiting for V10 to re-WUP, so I guess it's just because they are stupid.

well greed regarding WUP itself can't be right, cause anyone who hasn't WUPPED in the last 5 years can still download the latest version.. That's one of the longest free updates of any audio dev I have ever known.

AFAIK wup is needed for tech support and to get new plugins in bundles for free.. It's the latter where i have received nothing. Even mercury owners are getting shafted now as Waves will release "unique" stuff that isn't included in mercury, like pianos and keys for example.. The number of new freebies has dropped dramatically to what it used to be.

On the flip side, they have lowered their prices a LOT, so can't complain about that one and they are at least releasing new plugins fairly consistently.

But the OP's point holds.. WUP has no real point and it only makes sense to buy it if one needs to upgrade a version.. so, save your money until you absolutely need it.

I have wasted mine like a fool.. I never need tech support anyway as their stuff just works, so there's no point buying it for that either. ( I literally can not remember the last time i had a waves plugin crash, i have to hand it to them there).

Anyway, waves are losing the plot with regards to CPU usage of newer plugins, things are just not improving there..

The first real bad sign was with butch vig vocal strip, which uses more cpu for one instance (double), than the *entire* suite of fab filter plugins in series which can do 100x more (that's being conservative) when put together.

Now, I went to use their metafilter last night, and cpu in PT went from 6 percent to 17% for one instance.

I removed it, and instead inserted the DROP by cytomic, and CPU went from 6% to 7% LOL.

And the drop sounds better when doing resonant sweeps. (The drop sounds better than any filter plugin period IMO).
Still, i love the easy to use sequencer in meta filter and wish it didn't use so much overhead.

I have been steering away from waves for a while now and can't in all conscience recommend them to *anyone* anymore like I used to. They are literally unable to code modern plugins that are efficient. They can't do it.

They used to be the kings in this regard so i have no idea what is going on but things are just not getting better.
Part of me thunks they are doing it on purpose so people will buy their DSP servers (actually, now that I think about it, that's what it is.. Has to be).

Stay away from waves is my advice.. they could be improving things like metaflanger and updating it with modern tempo sync options like 16/8/4/2/1 bar rather than only very fast tempo sync options, or doubler, etc.. but all they keep on doing is releasing new cpu heavy plugins and never updating old ones anymore (graphic refresh for Q10 which is a joke compared to any modern EQ plugin anyway, and L1 do not count.)

Some proof of waves CPU inefficency..

1) As above with metafilter and butch vig
2) NLS uses 3.5x the cpu per instance of Slate VMR with VCC.. add that in a 64 channel project and difference is massive, let alone bigger projects
3) Omni channel uses more cpu per instance than using blue cat patchwork with 3rd party EQ/Compressor/Saturator etc.. My advice is make your own strip with blue cat, save it as a preset and recall it whenever you like.
A perfect example is using fab filter ProQ2, proC2, ProMB, Pro-DS, and Saturn, in a blue cat patchwork preset, will offer way more control than Scheps and uses half the overhead.
4) H Reverb vs Pro R or any other modern reverb plugin. It sounds great but why can Michael Carnes do a 5% reverb vs Waves 25%? No way it sounds 4x as good as exponential reverbs. Valhalla plate vs Abbey roads another example.. 40% vs 5 if that. And the kicker is, i haven't been able to get abbey road plate to sit in a mix a single time. Know plenty of others where it never ever makes it to actually be used in a song



They do make some good stuff.. very few and the only ones i recommend, and only when on sale for $29.. for example brauer motion is a great pan plugin and WITH modern sync options.
But why aren't they fixing cpu pigs like butch vig for example? it's not worth 40% of a core, not even close.

I actually decided to do an experiment to prove what cpu pigs they are vs every other awesome plugin brand.. Just opened a brand new PT project, inserted one audio file, have an avid pro limiter on master as i always do for safety, which takes the base rate from 1 percent to 3 percent, at 128 buffer with thunderbolt Apollo (the macbook in my stats).

Will be back with at least 10 comparison figures when done OT so i will start new topic.