Composing w/ and w/o Pro Tools, etc

[TTMJP]

I've been trying to read more about this particular topic, about composers approaching their job with such things as Pro Tools be different, compared to them without. Like the different benefits, approaches with and without, and a bit more..

I already know how the software works and all briefly, wondered if there was more to it..

Is there any good articles regarding this matter?

(Sorry, I hope this was related to digidesign general topic)

Thanks!

[mindnoise]

Hi,

this is really a broad topic to be answered quickly.
you should check youtube, there will be surely tutorial videos for the different DAW,
but a summing up of ALL of the is a little bit over the top.
Some magazine have a feature comparison chart but that shows very little to a specific strength of any DAW

so Pro Tools does NOT have the following (yet)
- Automatic Plug-in Delay Compensation (ADC) PT only has manual delay control
- Freezing Tracks
- Faster than Realtime bouncing.
- Extensive MIDI Environment MIDI Filters/Mappers etc.
- some more things I forgot

with regard to Logic , Cubase, Live,
PT was always a Post Production Tool not a Creativity Tool like the others

So when your idea is recorded PT is there to cut and refine it into a finished piece of music.
And this is where PT excels due to it´s clean interface.

The creative feature introduced in 8 were a HUGE step in the PT world but little compared to well Live, Logic etc.
But PT MIDI feature is still enough for me. Basic, straight foward and because of this sometimes a little bit of a long drag.
But cutting and managing Audio ist still the best feature by far.
So it depends of what kind of workflow you have.

This is really a far stretched topic, so a little bit more specific questions are welcome.
my 2¥ of opinion :)

best

[docbop]

It is a tool and everyone uses tools differently. Not all composers work at an instrument some sketch in their head or on paper an entire piece then use an instrument to hear and tweak. Others say DAW XYZ is better composer tool because of all the loops and VI's. Is that composition or building tracks??? It's all personal based on how you work,

[danander11]

I use PT for creation exclusively.. I started that way and continue that way.

Aside from timing (ie: play/pause, midi, and click), issues, I have found PT to be an excellent way for me to create. (all fixed for me in 8.0.1 btw)

A base template has a click track, two mono audio tracks, (one for guitar one for vox). I can set an idea down in almost no time and just let it rest until I feel it wanting to be fleshed out.

From there I can build in any fashion I want... It's certainly a lot easier that the dys of sitting around with a few fellows trying to get an idea across, (easy for some folks.. but for a non singing drummer with limited guitar and piano skill.. a tough row to hoe).

Now I can piece things together until I'm happy, then have talented friends come in and go right over the top.. no muss no fuss. and so fast.

I'm lovin PT right now...

(Once agan Digi, Thanks! for 8.0.1)

I would love to see improved bus and track counts without it costing a bloody fortune, offline rendering/bounce, and even ADC. But we'll see what 8.1 offers.

Maybe for Christmas?

[TTMJP]

Hi,

Thanks for the quick responses as usual. I see that there are computers cannot do everything yet it seems, I bet there's tons. That's gonna take forever to read, haha.

So what I'm interested in is that not what the program does, if you know what I mean... Like affects on cultural? artistic level, processes, yada yada...

It's really hard googling about this matter, all comes up with is music technology schools and something really short, haha.. Maybe I just suck at searching...

[John_Toolbox]

I use both PT and Logic.

PT is far easier to use for everything, but is also very limited on the MIDI side of things.

Logic has an incredible amount of power for midi, but has a lot of work to do on it's mixer and audio editing workflow features. Logic comes with an excellent set of virtual instruments and plugins out of the box as well(PT comes with some good stuff too, but not nearly as much).

I use Logic to start my projects, and PT to finish. I run the two apps on separate computers and sync them so I can use tools from both simultaneously.

This is not to say PT can't get the job done. I have written a lot of orchestral music entirely in PT(using 3rd party virtual instruments of course), and it sounds just as convincing as the stuff sequenced in Logic, you just have to learn to work around the limitations of PT.

[TTMJP]

Hmm, what I meant was not with other music softwares you see. Like with pro tools, (etc related softwares) and without computer music software in any level.

Sorry for the misunderstanding -- really suck at explaining here, haha..

[John_Toolbox]

Are you just asking about composing with or without a computer/DAW?

It's generally a preference, usually based on what you learned with. Most of the old school composers will sketch out their score on paper before moving to a keyboard or DAW, because when they learned music staff paper and pencil was the only thing available.

I prefer to draw the notes right into my DAW as I write, that way I don't have to correct playing errors. If something needs a real human feel like a solo instrument, I'll use a keyboard or my guitar(which has a midi pickup on it).

The only times I use paper is if I use a guitar(my primary instrument) to come up with an idea, I'll sketch out the tablature for my ideas quickly, and then come back to them to play in to a computer later.

[TTMJP]

Yeah, something like that!

I believe a lot of composers as Ennio Morricone uses paper and pen still, but I wonder if there is any old school musicians who actually learned how to use the latest evolvement in technology?

Like he used to do it this way, but now do it this way.

Also with technology now, and without technology before, like what the difference in result is?

Just want to know more about how it used to be done, some stick to the old style still because... or some changed to the newer style because...

It seems interesting, like i've skipped the old school style, want to know what differences of it, benefits and other way round.

Articles or interviews with those old school composers would be nice too, I just don't know too many... Most of my fav musicians as Glenn Gould, Vladimir Horowitz, they're all gone before this happened. I'm not too familiar.

[John_Toolbox]

One thing you could do is try to work with an older composer, offer to help them with the tech side of things and you will get hands on experience seeing how they work. I've been doing this with another composer for the last few months and it's been very helpful for both of us.

If you have the $$$ and get a chance to come to the states, I'd also strongly recommend Scott Smalley's Orchestration course. He has worked with a lot of the big name composers like Jerry Goldsmith, Danny Elfman, etc. and goes into detail about how they came up with various music for film. You get 2 huge books of scores, a lot of them are the original sketches done by these composers. I went this spring in LA and was very impressed with the course.

http://www.filmmusicinstitute.com/?page_id=39