Elastic Audio phase shift on multitrack drums

[Bart HLH]

I'm getting phase glitches when using elastic audio on multi-tracked drums. Tracks are grouped.
When I switch the Rhythmic plug-in from Real-time to rendered, I can see some tracks shift! Am I doing something wrong?

Please look at the screenshots to see what I mean.

http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/a...EArealtime.jpg
http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/a...EArendered.jpg

Thanks,
Bart

[audiogeekzine]

wow thats a lot of drift!

[Bart HLH]

Lowering the Event Sensitivity to 0% on all tracks except "SD" and "KD in" caused the shift.
No more shifting after I brought back event sensitivity to 100% on all tracks.

[audiogeekzine]

I've seen the same sorta thing when taking the sensitivity down to 0 in 7.4
Digi says not to do it, but often I hear glitches where the analysis markers.

Now I record the fixed drums to new tracks.

[KingFish]

I get artifacts WHEN using All tracks at at 100% sensitivity - Like using Beat Detective - I don't want the transients on Far away room mics, Overheads & The Hi Hat detected as anything I'l like to snap to the grid.

If "Digi says Not to lower the event sensitivity on other tracks" is there a "Proper - Digi qualified way / video tutorial anyone can send a link to, for fixing multi-track drums - that won't result in artifacts, and is guaranteed NOT to use the transients from a room mic in the group, as a "Quantize point" ???

[audiogeekzine]

I do it kinda like collection mode in beat detective. by that I mean I choose specific close mic tracks to snap to grid, the rest follow along.

kick and snare usually.
I don't use the quantize window. I just set my grid and do it by hand.

The hard part is when the client wants it drum machine tight, and not destroying the cymbals with artifacts, same problem with Beat Detective really.

[Dizzi45Z]

Originally Posted by Bart HLH

I'm getting phase glitches when using elastic audio on multi-tracked drums. Tracks are grouped.
When I switch the Rhythmic plug-in from Real-time to rendered, I can see some tracks shift! Am I doing something wrong?

Please look at the screenshots to see what I mean.

http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/a...EArealtime.jpg
http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/a...EArendered.jpg

Thanks,
Bart

Do you have fades on any of your audio Elastic Time Audio? There have been posts about a similar issue like this. It is stated in the manual that you need to consolidate your fades/crossfades before you initiate Elastic Time, otherwise you will have problems like this.

[Bart HLH]

Originally Posted by Dizzi45Z

Do you have fades on any of your audio Elastic Time Audio? There have been posts about a similar issue like this. It is stated in the manual that you need to consolidate your fades/crossfades before you initiate Elastic Time, otherwise you will have problems like this.

No, no fades on the tracks. The plan was to pocket the drumtracks before recording the other tracks (bass, guitar,...).

[PaulV]

Lowering the Event Sensitivity to 0% on all tracks except "SD" and "KD in" caused the shift.
No more shifting after I brought back event sensitivity to 100% on all tracks.

Yes, that makes sense; that would do it. That agrees with your screenshots, since there's no transients on many of the tracks. The Elastic Audio plugins (especially Rhythmic) really do need those analysis markers in there to tell the plugin where the individual transients are in the audio. When you take the sensitivity down to 0, you take away all of the information needed by the plugin to do its work - they're a bit like an instruction list for Rhythmic on where to cut each drum hit as to space them properly. Without these, it will "cut and splice" the drum hits at less ideal points, and you'll get things out of phase. Quantize also needs these in there to do its job properly.

It was like this in 7.4, but some of the changes to improve the sound quality of Rhythmic in 8.0 cause these to be even more important now. If you find you've got transients in the wrong places, you'll need to work with the Sensitivity setting a bit more subtly, and perhaps do a bit of manual editing in Analysis view if they're still not quite right.

[Dizzi45Z]

If what has been stated is true, then it really only leaves the option to go through and do it all by hand unless you can quantize the kick and snare with other tracks at 0% sensitivity and then turn them back up to 100% after they are quantized.

What Pro Tools needs is the ability to select or un-select the tracks you want to be taken in account of with the quantize. Imagine how nice it would be to select just the close microphone tracks and then quantize all the tracks in the group with just the analysis markers of those close microphone tracks.