trying to keep levels low

[pisces]

im recording to pro tools with the control 24 and ive heard from many ppl dont get too close to 0 on the channel strip.well i have recently been stopping when it hits the yelloe which is -14 i think.all the drums put together brings the master at a good level.but as u all know the human voice is unpredictable and so is the snare and such.so well my question when i do a song that has just vocals and guitar should i record hotter?since there only two tracks.i think johnny cashs acoustic stuff is very loud and compressed but clean i kinda want that.

[JFreak]

Practically:

Whatever gives you the sound you're looking for, use it!

In theory:

There was a reason to record as hot as possible during the 16 bit era (max 96dB dynamics), but that reason vanished when we got 24 bits. Today, even the best A/D converters have about 120dB dynamics, which means they cannot output more than 20 bits of useful data. Key word here being "noise floor". So, as long as you can capture the dynamics and keep the noise low enough, there's no reason to try to "hit the red". You can always bring up the volume later.

Now there's a middle ground between theory and practice. Even if theoretically you could get the same results by recording at very low levels, you can get your desired results faster by upping the gain before A/D conversion. This is what you had in mind, right? There is only one thing you need to take care of: the levels MUST NOT CLIP. As long as you don't clip, it's okay to record as hot as you like. You can use analog limiter before conversion to make sure your levels are safe, but if you don't have one, a compressor with more than 10:1 ratio should also work nicely. Remember, you're not trying to alter sound by that dynamics control, but only control peaks so they're not clipping no matter what happens.

"just do it"

[pisces]

thx.for the advice.so your saying that if my levels are -2 or -8 it will be the same sound.?ive heard from ppl that its cleaner at -8 peaking.but i dunno/lol.if i was working on my own songs i have all the time i9n the world to retrack but i was conserned about the client with no budget for messups.

[M.Brane]

The low-level tracking thing has more to do with not stressing your front end/converters. One you are inside the box as long as you don't clip you're fine, but it's still a good idea to leave plenty of headroom so you can concentrate on mixing without being worried about clipping things. You can always make up the gain later if you want more volume, and if all your tracks have been recorded/mixed clean the results of that will be much better than if you've run everything right up to the ceiling.

[JFreak]

so your saying that if my levels are -2 or -8 it will be the same sound.?ive heard from ppl that its cleaner at -8 peaking.

Yes. If there's a difference, then you're very likely clipping some transients. If you don't clip it anywhere, you don't have to worry about levels. Better a little lower than a little clipped.

[RadioMoo]

u all know the human voice is unpredictable and so is the snare and such.so well my question when i do a song that has just vocals and guitar should i record hotter?

Vocals and snare for sure are among the toughest to tame, but the idea here is that you don't want to clip the converters
going in, and you don't want to clip the track itself.

Go HERE and see some other thoughts on this, and follow the link that's in the thread.

If your stuff has plenty of headroom while you're tracking and mixing, you'll get a nice clean, full-bodied sound. If you actually sound like Johnny Cash, that's a real plus.

[akakpaws]

Should you also suggest what the threshold setting should be in addition to the compression (10:1) ratio setting?

[M.Brane]

Should you also suggest what the threshold setting should be in addition to the compression (10:1) ratio setting?

It's pretty much impossible to suggest a threshold setting that will work over the internet.

Use your ears.

[mcgirr]

This is the reason that program dependant limiters have stood the test of time.(optical comp/limiters)

While comp/limiters like the la2a and la-610 are not cheap by any strech of the imagination...
They are critical studio tools for taming the tracks that can have vast dynamic range.

Vocals are the most prime example. It is literally IMPOSSIBLE to tame a vocalist w/ great range w/o limiting. The signal will be far to weak on the subtle phrasing and the meter will blow the roof off when they start to belt it out.(Lots of wasted takes.)

Acoustic guitars and other instruments(horns for one)can also pose problems.

The tubes that are present in these units can also provide an "ear pleasing" tone.

Many recording engineers who rely on fet comps(1176 ect....) say that they will literally sit on the 8:1 button. But...

As some have stated previously there will never be a ONE sure fire ratio. All tracks require an individual evaluation dependant on the range of that program.(track, instrument ect....)

Best wishes.