connecting a patchbay to fast track ultra 8r

[frn0003]

Im doing the best I can, thanks for your help.

[Bill Denton]

Originally Posted by frn0003

Im doing the best I can, thanks for your help.

Please accept my apology...my comment was unnecessary...

[Bill Denton]

Originally Posted by mesaone

Come on, Bill. We all started somewhere. He knows the purpose and value of patchbays, and obviously did some due diligence before asking.

You're right...I'm offering an apology...

[frn0003]

No problem, im just trying to figure out how to use out board gear to save on cpu usage,

[Bill Denton]

Originally Posted by frn0003

No problem, im just trying to figure out how to use out board gear to save on cpu usage,

Still, I let a bad day allow me to be rude to someone who did not deserve it. And I truly apologize...

[albee1952]

Originally Posted by frn0003

I have a few compressors and 2 lexicon reverb units and not enough channels. I plan to add more.

Would I be correct that the compressors are something in the "budget" description(DBX, Alesis, RNC)? While I might use gentle compression while tracking(with external mic preamps in the chain), plugins will match or beat any "budget" compressor(please correct me if you have 1176 or Distressors) As for the Lexicons, they make great reverbs, but they also offer plugin versions that are equal or better than their mid-range hardware(MPX and LXP lines) and plugins would also give to "total recall" of settings, which really is an important feature to most of us I'm not trying to be discouraging, just pointing out that there are options that might serve your needs better. For instance, if your computer is not capable of handling your needs, I would spend your money on improving that end

[frn0003]

The compressor is a HHB radius 50 preamp compressor and the lexicon is a mx300, Im also trying to learn how to patch them using a patchbay, I want to know how to do this and I agree the plug-ins are very good. I guess what I'm saying is I want to know as much as I can. I just can't figure out if the patchbay should be normaled or de-normaled and where I should run the ins and outs to and from the fast track ultra 8r. I may not know a lot about this but I was asking if anyone would be willing to help me, I love this stuff..

[Darryl Ramm]

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/mar9...patchbays.html

[Bill Denton]

Originally Posted by frn0003

The compressor is a HHB radius 50 preamp compressor and the lexicon is a mx300, Im also trying to learn how to patch them using a patchbay, I want to know how to do this and I agree the plug-ins are very good. I guess what I'm saying is I want to know as much as I can. I just can't figure out if the patchbay should be normaled or de-normaled and where I should run the ins and outs to and from the fast track ultra 8r. I may not know a lot about this but I was asking if anyone would be willing to help me, I love this stuff..

I know you probably think we're a bunch of d*cks around here, but we're really not. Sure, a patchbay seems so simple, but it can lead to tears, shame, even death! No, wait, that's premarital sex...

But a patchbay is a bit more complicated that it appears to be...it looks really cool so everybody wants one, but they are far often more trouble than they're worth. But if your goal is more learning about stuff, let me see if I can help you out. I'm gonna give you the "standard spiel"...if I'm telling you stuff you already know, just scan through it, but it does get complicated...let us know if you have further questions.

I'm going to assume you have the type of patchbay found in most home studios...it has two rows of 24 1/4" jacks on the front and on the back. Each jack on the front is permanently wired to the corresponding jack on the back...top row jack 8 on the front is wired to top row back 8 on the back (which is why the numbers on the front read left-to-right 1-24, while the numbers on the back read right-to-left 24-1).

Another thing to consider is balanced vs unbalanced patchbays...you will need to know about balanced vs unbalanced connections...if you don't, that's your reading assignment. But just as a broad, general "rule", you would typically use a balanced patchbay to interconnect studio gear, while an unbalanced patchbay might be used to interconnect synths.

Among other advantages, a patchbay allows you to connect/reconnect gear without having to crawl around behind racks (not fun when you're age 65, like me!) It also eliminates the need to directly connect/reconnect cables to gear...jacks do wear out (or suffer other damage) from frequently plugging/unplugging...it's a lot cheaper to replace a patchbay than to replace the jacks on gear.

Note...from this point on I might need to mention something at one point in the discussion so you'll be aware of it, but not explain it until later...but it will get explained.

In your original post you mentioned "inputs", "outputs", and "normals".

A patchbay doesn't really have inputs or outputs...it's just jacks. If you don't care about normals you can connect gear any place you want to...top row, bottom row...front, back...and connect everything with patch cords...the technical term for doing things that way is "really 'effing stupid".

There are several types of normalling that may be used with a patchbay...in order to be able to use all of the normalling methods, you will need to connect your gear to the patchbay in a specific manner. Note that normal typically refers to a connection between a jack on the top row on the front of the patchbay and the corresponding jack on the bottom row on the front. On the typical home studio patchbay, normals may be set on a top and bottom pair-by-pair basis...in other words, jack pair 1 may use one normaling scheme, pair 2 may use a different one, and so on...this is typically set by some type of switch.

There are three main types of normals...straight-through (or non-normalled)...half-normal...full normal. Here's how they operate...

• Straight-through - This is also called non-normalled. There is no connection between a jack on the top row and the corresponding jack on the bottom row. Typically only used for special situations.
  
• Half-normal - This is also called listen-in and is probably the most commonly-used normalling scheme in home studios. The top-row jack is "normally" connected to the corresponding bottom-row jack. Inserting a plug into the top-row jack does not break the circuit. Inserting a plug into the bottom-row jack does break the circuit. Note that patchbays came out of the telephone industry...the reason this type of normal is called a "listen-in"...since inserting a plug into the top jack does not break the circuit, a technician could plug a special headphone into the top jack to verify the presence of a signal, or to see if one's spouse is talking to another man/woman! In the audio industry, it is typically used to feed a signal to two (or more) different destinations at once (called a "mult"...Google it), or to send a different signal to a specific destination.
  
• Full normal - Similar to a half-normal, the top-row jack is "normally" connected to the corresponding bottom-row jack. But, inserting a plug into either the top-row jack or the bottom-row jack breaks the circuit.

Now to inputs and outputs...

One important note...when using a "home studio" patchbay, you do not want to run microphones through the patchbay. This is to prevent damage to the phantom power circuits used in most preamps. Microphone connections are handled in a different manner.

In the following example we will use the quite common situation where you have a mic preamp which feeds a compressor, which then feeds a line input on your audio interface. And while there are always exceptions, this is how you should do things when starting out...as always, learn the rules, then you can figure out the exceptions.

First, the "rules"...

• The output of a piece of equipment is connected to a jack on the top row on the back of the patchbay.
  
• The input to a piece of equipment is connected to a jack on the bottom row on the back of the patchbay.
  
• The input and output of a single piece of equipment should not be connected to corresponding top and bottom jacks...this would simply be connecting the input to the output, which is kinda pointless.
  
• Patch cords are connected to the front jacks on the patchbay.
  

Now let's look at our example...note that all of these jack pairs should be half-normalled.

• The input to the preamp is a mic, which does not go through the patchbay.
• The output of the preamp is connected to the top #1 jack.
• The input of the compressor is connected to the bottom #1 jack.
• The output of the compressor is connected to the top #2 jack.
• The input (line input) of your audio interface is connected to the bottom #2 jack.

This will give you a signal flow of: Preamp > #1 top > normal > #1 bottom > compressor > #2 top > normal > #2 bottom > audio interface.

Hopefully you can see why nobody wanted to explain all of this if you didn't really need a patchbay, but we're always happy to help people learn stuff.

Post any questions you might have...good luck!

[albee1952]

Great post from Bill(but I'm not sure about the premarital sex part....). Once you get all this down(and you get a huge "thumbs up" from me for diving in to learn), here's your first curve ball; The Lexicon might be best used via SPDIF connections(I will say it for you....."damn you, Dave")