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  #101  
Old 12-19-2013, 07:02 PM
rockridge98 rockridge98 is offline
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Default Re: Conumdrum: New Mac Pro?

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Originally Posted by RyanC View Post
Probably the best for audio is the start with the 4 core (unless anyone needs the better GPUs), there is no downgrade to the D300 gpu when you start with the 6 core.
Not true.
Go to http://store.apple.com/us/buy-mac/mac-pro, select the $2999 quad-core option on the left,
and you can then select any of 4, 6, 8, or 12 cores while keeping D300 GPU.
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  #102  
Old 12-19-2013, 08:20 PM
nst7 nst7 is offline
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Default Re: Conumdrum: New Mac Pro?

Correct. By just upgrading that to the 6 core the price is a somewhat reasonable $3500.
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  #103  
Old 12-19-2013, 09:17 PM
RyanC RyanC is offline
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Default Re: Conumdrum: New Mac Pro?

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Originally Posted by rockridge98 View Post
Not true.
Go to http://store.apple.com/us/buy-mac/mac-pro, select the $2999 quad-core option on the left,
and you can then select any of 4, 6, 8, or 12 cores while keeping D300 GPU.
I think you are saying the same thing I was saying...If you want the d300 (or don't want to pay for the better ones), you have to start with the 4 core.
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  #104  
Old 12-19-2013, 09:24 PM
rockridge98 rockridge98 is offline
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Default Re: Conumdrum: New Mac Pro?

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Originally Posted by RyanC View Post
I think you are saying the same thing I was saying...If you want the d300 (or don't want to pay for the better ones), you have to start with the 4 core.
OK. I thought you were saying that Apple wouldn't let you order a d300 at all unless you picked the 4 core option.
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  #105  
Old 12-19-2013, 09:54 PM
RyanC RyanC is offline
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Default Re: Conumdrum: New Mac Pro?

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Originally Posted by garnoil View Post
*practical use*...what do you think of my situation: I am maxing out my current Mac Pro 2.26 Ghz (not enough CPU remove plugins), and my HDX card shows about 70% full. I just bought revibe so I am sure I will max out my HDX card on my next film. Films I do use about 200 audio tracks, + all 4 sets of re-record 5/1 stems as I record to tracks not bounce to disk. I use about 12 auxes (may be 16), with may be 4 surrounds and the others stereo.

So coming from an old 2.26 Ghz Mac, if I get the 6 core will I be able to run many -I mean a lot like another 150 native plugs- without the machine running out of CPU? Right now, I am very limited as to how many Native plugs I can use.

Lastly, I am also going to buy another HDX card so that I can run 500+ voices. I also use full video 1920X1080 in the same machine.

Any knowledgeable insight is appreciated as I have no idea how better the new machines are or not.

G
A 2009 2.26 dual quad? SSDs? VI's? Are you running 10 or 11? Are you maxing out voices for your HDX1?

Long story short my guess would be that for the budget you are talking about the 12c would be worth it. It's certainly diminishing returns per dollar, but so is HDX. But when you need the extra and the work is paying for it then it's worth it, and when you need more voices you need more HDX cards.

I understand all the reasons not to go windows, and/or hack, but for 11 especially and even more so for those who don't need the lowest two buffer settings, a dual 12c is going to be an absolute monster...not that I'll be doing it, I like OSX that much more.

My rough guess assuming nothing is flawed with the nMP for audio is that if you go PT10 to PT10 a 12c nMP will be about double the native power at 44.1/128 or 96/256 than the 2.26 8c.

Last edited by RyanC; 12-20-2013 at 02:37 AM.
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  #106  
Old 12-19-2013, 09:56 PM
RyanC RyanC is offline
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Default Re: Conumdrum: New Mac Pro?

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Originally Posted by rockridge98 View Post
OK. I thought you were saying that Apple wouldn't let you order a d300 at all unless you picked the 4 core option.
Unless you start with the 4c. If you start with the 6c the base gpu is the d500 and at least here on the apple store there is no option to downgrade it.

EDIT: re-read we are saying the same thing I think? I was only suggesting that audio guys not using opengl should start with the 4c and upgrade the proc, because with the base 6c you are paying for a GPU that most of us (even post guys) probably don't need.

Last edited by RyanC; 12-20-2013 at 02:40 AM.
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  #107  
Old 12-20-2013, 02:35 AM
RyanC RyanC is offline
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Default Re: Conumdrum: New Mac Pro?

hi

Last edited by RyanC; 12-20-2013 at 02:35 AM. Reason: double
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  #108  
Old 12-20-2013, 04:45 AM
garnoil garnoil is offline
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Default Re: Conumdrum: New Mac Pro?

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Originally Posted by RyanC View Post
A 2009 2.26 dual quad? SSDs? VI's? Are you running 10 or 11? Are you maxing out voices for your HDX1?

Long story short my guess would be that for the budget you are talking about the 12c would be worth it. It's certainly diminishing returns per dollar, but so is HDX. But when you need the extra and the work is paying for it then it's worth it, and when you need more voices you need more HDX cards.

I understand all the reasons not to go windows, and/or hack, but for 11 especially and even more so for those who don't need the lowest two buffer settings, a dual 12c is going to be an absolute monster...not that I'll be doing it, I like OSX that much more.

My rough guess assuming nothing is flawed with the nMP for audio is that if you go PT10 to PT10 a 12c nMP will be about double the native power at 44.1/128 or 96/256 than the 2.26 8c.
I am running PT 11. I do not use VIs ever, I do strictly post. I can work with a 256 or 512 buffer setting for sgx and sound design, and even longer for strictly mix, but of course I prefer to run 64 buffer and have a responsive machine. I never record music or singers, I only record ADR which is one microphone at the time (actually 3 mics a studio mic a lav and a boom) - so 3 inputs maximum, never more.

I am not maxing the HDX card yet, I am using about 70% but since I just got Revibe, I will be using several instances of Revibe DSP and stop using Native verbs (my machine can not handle any more Native plugs). Once I start using Revibe DSP (on my next film that starts today) , I will max out the HDX card. Also, Nugen ISL will soon be DSP (that is what I heard) so I will be using several instances of it also DSP.

My work is indie films and my last film, which was a sci-fi/horror, used almost all the 256 voices so I am thinking of adding another HDX card to up the voice count to 512. I need a machine that is reliability and fast to boot up.

Windows would be much, much cheaper, As business, it would make total sense to run Windows and save as much as $7000 dollars on hardware (trip to Caribbean instead?) but for me OSX is the way to go (unless I change my mind and go windows purely as a business reason).

Lastly, someone said that Apple may license the OSX to run on a Windows machine legally? any info on this?
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  #109  
Old 12-20-2013, 08:33 AM
propower propower is offline
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Default Re: Conumdrum: New Mac Pro?

My impression...
In this scenario it actually looks like more DSP power will address your issues right now (even with your current machine since VI's are not an issue). Native verbs are the power hungry ones. Put those on your card and see how much different things are. Most of the bread and butter stuff (EQ, Delay, Comp in Native) are super CPU friendly (at least the likes of AVID stuff and Softube for instance). Regardless it looks like you are headed to a second HDx card for voice reasons so why not put it into your current set up?

The 12c will of course be a great machine for you and in this application HDx2 + 12 core - why not (its just money ... But after HDx2 even the new hex core might be just fine too.

PS>> in this scenario does buffer 64 really help make the machine more responsive (- really I don't know so no problem if I am wrong but it looks like a lot of extra CPU load for very little gain)? Latency is not an issue. PT11 w/64G ram and fuull timeline cache (is this enough?) looks like more the ticket to super responsive system and kick the buffer to the weeds... 1024
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  #110  
Old 12-20-2013, 09:00 AM
garnoil garnoil is offline
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Default Re: Conumdrum: New Mac Pro?

Quote:
Originally Posted by propower View Post
My impression...
In this scenario it actually looks like more DSP power will address your issues right now (even with your current machine since VI's are not an issue). Native verbs are the power hungry ones. Put those on your card and see how much different things are. Most of the bread and butter stuff (EQ, Delay, Comp in Native) are super CPU friendly (at least the likes of AVID stuff and Softube for instance). Regardless it looks like you are headed to a second HDx card for voice reasons so why not put it into your current set up?

The 12c will of course be a great machine for you and in this application HDx2 + 12 core - why not (its just money ... But after HDx2 even the new hex core might be just fine too.

PS>> in this scenario does buffer 64 really help? Latency is not an issue. Is the machine sluggish at other settings?

Yes, I bought Revibe DSP to put the load of the verbs on the HDX card, I will be using a combination of stereo and 5/1 Revibe instances (may be 3 stereo and 2 surround). Right now I am running about 180 tracks with Avid's Channel strip -not my favorite but usable for all sfx, Foley, and ambient tracks and it is DSP (so that load goes on the HDX card). My DX tracks, which I usually have about 12 per film have this chain per track: Equality, CEDAR DNS (2 stacks), and the Avid de-esser because it is DSP (I hardly use the de-esser as I do the esses manually). My auxes are: DX in mono, DX in stereo, DX special effects with inserts of PSP echo, delay, special verbs, futz, etc. music aux 5/1, sfx aux 5/1. My dx auxes have plugs starting with Equality, CEDAR dns one, and Nugen ISL (just for ISL peaks as I do all dialogue micro-dynamics manually).

I also run full video 1920X1080 either Pro-Res or Avid codec.

When I had TDM Accel 2 all of my plugins were Native and the machine was not choking, very similar set up as I have now with the same plugins as I have now (except Revibe which I just got). Since I went HDX 1, may be because the extra 64 voices, my machine chokes all the time. I can only run a few native plugs like my equality and DNS, but if I put in for example a convolution such as the IRL it'll start to slowdown and become un-stable. I tried using the Waves 360 verb, and it was no go, machine just says running out of CPU remove plugs, same with Revolver, I still have to try Reverberator which I also have.

So, based on what I am experiencing I think I need a faster CPU, especially if I do get a second HDX card. The better option would be to get plugins that I could load to the HDX card but that is not happening as developers appear not to be porting to HDX that much.
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