Avid Pro Audio Community

Avid Pro Audio Community

How to Join & Post  •  Community Terms of Use  •  Help Us Help You

Knowledge Base Search  •  Community Search  •  Learn & Support


Avid Home Page

Go Back   Avid Pro Audio Community > Pro Tools Software > Windows

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 04-26-2019, 07:50 PM
Keidiek Keidiek is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: San Gabriel, CA
Posts: 9
Default Ran Out of CPU (conventional fix did not help)

Hey guys,

I used to use Pro Tools a lot and I remember it had its quirks on Windows, but recently I have had to return to using it for a studio collab and I don't think I'd ever had this much trouble fixing an error.

The error message is the standard, run of the mill "Pro Tools ran out of CPU power, try deactivating or removing Native Plugins," except even when I removed all plugins and the click track, as an empty project the error still happened. My project worked fine until this happened and now I can't get it to work. Once the file "breaks," the file(and associated backup files) never works again, and it can't close without force quitting from the task manager. If I bounce all the midi and reload every Virtual Instrument in a new project it works...but eventually the new project will "break" too. Why? In the System Usage window the CPU is sitting consistently at a comfy 15%, RAM never tops 45%.

I used the Trasher app for prefs. I'm on a Surfacebook 2 with Windows 10, 16GB i7 processor. I've optimized my drives and power settings, always run without virus protection, I use a Mackie onyx interface and in the project I'm using Kontakt, PLAY and iZotope plugins. It's ProTools Ultimate, currently in the free trial period.

I was using Nuendo and Studio One up until now. My hard disk is at about 80% capacity (SSD)

I've been scouring the internet for clues...Am I missing something?

Last edited by Keidiek; 04-27-2019 at 10:33 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 04-29-2019, 08:23 AM
junkgear's Avatar
junkgear junkgear is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 1,147
Default Re: Ran Out of CPU (conventional fix did not help)

I'd try doing all the system optimizations listed in this Sweetwater guide.

If that doesn't help, then when the problems happens again, instead of checking the PT system resources, open Windows Task Manager and see what your CPU and Memory usage shows. It may give you a better idea as to what is consuming your resources.
__________________
Will K

System Details
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 04-29-2019, 09:42 AM
Keidiek Keidiek is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: San Gabriel, CA
Posts: 9
Default Re: Ran Out of CPU (conventional fix did not help)

Thank you for the advice!

The CPU monitor in the Windows Task Manager similarly shows that its not even at 20% CPU, and the RAM isn't going above 45%. I think the key issue is that the CPU is not actually running out. Pro Tools just thinks it is.

I did optimization according to the Avid PC Optimization checklist, but there seem to be a couple of new items on the Sweetwater one; I'm trying those now. Hopefully moving my project files to an external does the trick.

Last edited by Keidiek; 04-29-2019 at 09:54 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 04-29-2019, 11:35 AM
Keidiek Keidiek is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: San Gabriel, CA
Posts: 9
Default Re: Ran Out of CPU (conventional fix did not help)

Okay, I have now completed every last item in the optimization guideline, and the problem is not fixed. I triple checked, and the CPU/RAM are still totally healthy in both System Usage and Task Manager.

For now I'm just bouncing the midi and audio so I can start over, but that's a time consuming fix. Is there anything I can do to prevent my files from "breaking" like this? I can't just switch back to Nuendo because the studio I'm working with requires frequent swapping of Pro Tools files.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 04-29-2019, 12:24 PM
Darryl Ramm Darryl Ramm is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 12,965
Default Re: Ran Out of CPU (conventional fix did not help)

Basic basic stuff... what IO buffer size and sample rate are you working at? Disk cache size? Recording audio to what make/model drive? What audio interface and driver version (if ASIO4ALL confess that now...).

Start with standard troubleshooting steps under “help us help you” up the top of each DUC web page.

Paying attention to trashing prefs (frequently as you try other stuff), troubleshooting plugins (*always* suspect plugins)—test removing all third party plugin files, putting them back in batches, etc. or looking for a corrupt session. You may also need to print/freeze tracks, reduce long chaining of tracks/busses.

The “conventional fix” is to try all that troubleshooting. No point really posting here until you have done that, and if still stuck describe carefully what you tried.

There is nothing unusual here. Pro Tools really does not “think” or care about what any CPU usage meter says. When internal latency to get things done takes more than the allowable small time then Pro Tools calls this CPU error. Looking at meters rarely helps solve anything, especially with confusion hyperthreading introduces, most CPU problems appear exactly as here.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 04-29-2019, 12:38 PM
Keidiek Keidiek is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: San Gabriel, CA
Posts: 9
Default Re: Ran Out of CPU (conventional fix did not help)

Thank you Darryl.

As you can see above, I already mentioned in the OP that I did try those things. Perhaps I didn't mention the I/O buffer/sample size/Cache (44.1kHz, 16bit, normal Cache size), but that aside it's all there.

I detailed the plugins used, and wrote that I tried removing them all. I trashed the prefs. I'm using Mackie Onyx with the latest driver version. Because removing all of the plugins did nothing, I feel as though freezing wouldn't help either.

I acknowledge and respect that forum posts are a last resort and that searching/troubleshooting on one's own must always come first. I seek your help because I did so, I tried all of the basic stuff, and it did not work.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 04-29-2019, 12:59 PM
Darryl Ramm Darryl Ramm is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 12,965
Default Re: Ran Out of CPU (conventional fix did not help)

WHAT IS THE PLAYBACK ENGINE IO BUFFER SIZE? this is the most critical thing affecting CPU usage. Don't guess, double check to see it is actually set to what you think it is.

Disk cache == normal is turned off. Set it to a few GB. (but it's unclear how much actual recorded audio is actually in your session, that detail would help).

Make sure ignore errors is unchecked while troubleshooting.

What recording drive are you recording to?

You name plugins that are well known for causing issues. So more reasons to suspect stuff there.

When you say you removed the plugins, did you remove the actual plugin files from the plugin folder? (<= do this) Or removed/disabled the plugin instances in the session? It was not totally clear what you meant in the first post.

Does this happen with other sessions? Does it happen if you create a new session from scratch (not from a template). Does this happen if you create a new Windows Admin account and test from there? Again trash prefs between trying different stuff.

If you removed all third party plugin files and still have a problem. What other plugin are instantiated in that session? If you have sessions with no plugins installed for them them at all and they are crashing with CPU errors it is very likely the session is just corrupt. You need to try Save As and/or import content into a new session. If sessions repeatedly get corrupted... the first thing would be to exclude plugins, check they are up to date/compatible with your version of Pro Tools, look on vendor forum for know issues, etc.

Last edited by Darryl Ramm; 04-29-2019 at 01:51 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 04-29-2019, 05:21 PM
Keidiek Keidiek is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: San Gabriel, CA
Posts: 9
Default Re: Ran Out of CPU (conventional fix did not help)

Playback IO buffer size was sitting at 1028. I also raised it to 2056 but that didn't seem to change things. I changed the Disk cache as per your suggestion(there isn't much recorded audio in my session, just a single comped flute track.)

I'm recording to the internal SSD.

I removed the plugins from the session; I couldn't find a plugin folder within the DAW. When you say remove them from the plugin folder, do you mean I should delete them from the folder on my computer that Pro Tools is referencing to load them up? (I beg your patience if that is an ignorant question.)

If I create the session from scratch everything is fine, but if I walk away for two minutes and come back, I hit play and it's irreparably stuck in this CPU glitch. This workaround requires a lot of time, too, since I'm loading up an orchestra's worth of sample libraries, routing them, etc...

From what you're saying I'm wondering if something is wrong with my plugins. In this new version that just "broke" today, I was only using PLAY, Kontakt 5, and one little DVerb on an aux track.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 04-29-2019, 08:17 PM
Darryl Ramm Darryl Ramm is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 12,965
Default Re: Ran Out of CPU (conventional fix did not help)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keidiek View Post
Playback IO buffer size was sitting at 1028. I also raised it to 2056 but that didn't seem to change things. I changed the Disk cache as per your suggestion(there isn't much recorded audio in my session, just a single comped flute track.)

I'm recording to the internal SSD.
OK great a very large buffer size, so that's excluded.

And in this case the fast internal NVMe SSD is the place to record to, I just wanted to make sure a slow external drive is not involved here (they can trigger CPU errors at times), but since you don't have much audio recorded it's likely not an issue. And neither is likely disk cache, but you might as well leave that set to say 2GB... but that takes 2GB away from system memory... which you might need later if you run out of memory for VIs.

Quote:
I removed the plugins from the session; I couldn't find a plugin folder within the DAW. When you say remove them from the plugin folder, do you mean I should delete them from the folder on my computer that Pro Tools is referencing to load them up? (I beg your patience if that is an ignorant question.)
I mean exactly what I said. You remove the plugin files from the plugin folder. You were a google away from knowing what the plugins live in C:\Program Files\Common Files\Avid\Audio\Plug-Ins. Quit Pro Tools. Move *all* .aaxplugin files in that plugin folder elsewhere (anywhere, but the Unused folder is a good place) and restart Pro Tools. It will automagically put back the default Pro Tools plugins.

I've pretty much already described what to do then... but start by seeing if you can reproduce the problems you have seen, if say that needs leaving the computer alone for a while. (and you should have already disabled all computer, disk drive and USB sleep/suspend behavior) Then put back the third party plugin files in batches, starting with some of the ones you are using/needing most and seeing if you can then reproduce the problem again. The problem may not be so much you get an immediate CPU error, it may be that you get a sequence of things happen that then cause CPU errors (with what sounds more and more like a corrupt session).

As suggested before you should investigate if those sessions are corrupt. Again, try importing the session content into new sessions.

Remove all instances of the DVerb plugin while you do all all these other tests (you don't need to uninstall the DVerb .aaxplugin file, just remove the DVerb plugin insert inside Pro Tools, you can't just remove the plugin as Pro Tools will keep putting it back.). That makes sure you are not being hit by denormalization problems with DVerb. I doubt that is an issue, but it;s trivial to exclude so just do it. You can google denomalization if you want to learn more. Put back DVerb only once you have everything else working great.

Quote:
If I create the session from scratch everything is fine, but if I walk away for two minutes and come back, I hit play and it's irreparably stuck in this CPU glitch. This workaround requires a lot of time, too, since I'm loading up an orchestra's worth of sample libraries, routing them, etc...

From what you're saying I'm wondering if something is wrong with my plugins. In this new version that just "broke" today, I was only using PLAY, Kontakt 5, and one little DVerb on an aux track.
Who knows... but again you should always start by suspecting plugins. Did you check that the versions of all the plugins you have are up to date/compatible with the Pro Tools and OS version you have? That's called out in the troubleshooting steps. If you did not do that start there before doing detailed plugin troubleshooting. If you have any suspicion about what is installed grab the correct plugin installers, uninstall the plugins and run them again. It's very easy to mess this up if you have a say a pile of old plugin installs for other DAWs (including having installed aaxplugins plugins) and then drop a Pro Tools install on top of that.

And plugins can cause all kinds of CPU and memory problems by just being installed in a DAW, you don't even need to instantiate them, just have them in the plugin folder. It's more likely that plugins you actually have instantiated in a session will cause problems (esp. ones that corrupt sessions), but don't assume they have to be... except DVerb and other plugins that can have denormalization problems, that issue needs to plugins to be instantiated in the session not just installed.

---

Jeez I made the mistake of looking over the standard troubleshooting steps, these are in bad need of being cleaned up and updated.

Last edited by Darryl Ramm; 04-30-2019 at 06:18 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 04-30-2019, 11:15 AM
Keidiek Keidiek is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: San Gabriel, CA
Posts: 9
Default Re: Ran Out of CPU (conventional fix did not help)

Okay, so it was the common files folder you were talking about. Wasn't sure if you meant inside the actual program or not.

Well I removed all the plugin files(and retrashed prefs) and it still didn't change the error. I think as you suspected, the session files are becoming corrupt somehow, but how can I nail down what keeps corrupting them? My Kontakt and PLAY are all up to date, and while my Melodyne is old as heck, I've used it in small audio projects with no issues... The "big midi" projects aren't even really that big. We're talking like twenty channels of instrument tracks(albeit a few of the instruments are chunky.)

I've noticed PT takes a little over 6 minutes to load up(even before opening a project) and the NotResponding wheel appears intermittently during this process. Opening an actual project takes closer to twenty minutes (even without the hefty 8dio libraries.) That's a sign something is wrong even beyond the session, I presume.

Thank you for your continued help; with deadlines drawing nigh I'm getting rather flummoxed. ��
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
control 24 vs conventional mixing board c-post ICON & C|24 3 05-05-2007 02:19 PM
Can Pro Control replace a conventional desk? jaffaman Pro Tools TDM Systems (Mac) 42 12-26-1999 04:33 AM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 05:12 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Limited. Forum Hosted By: URLJet.com