Slow PAL Sync?

[Digibill]

I'm about to get started mixing a PAL 25fps short film. Client is exporting OMF out of Final Cut, and will provide a Quicktime for me to work with. The client will be transferring at some point to HD, and I was going to provide AIFF files. The post house doing the transfer said to make sure the audio was "slow PAL sync". And that the audio people should know what that is.

OK, I routinely expect the video guys to know more than they appear to, but they've got me stumped on this. This is my first PAL project, and I have no idea what "slow PAL sync" means.

Anyone?

Thanks.

Bill

[Richard Fairbanks]

I have not heard that term before. Shoot at 25, transfer to film and project at 24?? I've heard of people shooting at 24 and transfering to PAL, but not 25 to 24.

[DigiTechSupt]

Slow PAL is used when you need to stay NTSC but the PAL video cannot, for some reason, be actually converted to NTSC. Instead the PAL video is played back at 23.976 frames per second and a 3/2 sequence is added to make an NTSC version.

[Richard Fairbanks]

In other words... normal .1% pulldown, right?

[minister]

from 25 to 23.976? isn't that as we learned, 4.272%? or am i confused?

[Eric L]

25 to 23.98 (29.97) =-4.096%

Time to revisit the math, I'd say.

Pull Down math

[minister]

yeah, i remember that one as it was me who got you guys to correct me.... but what is the difference between what you are saying and what todd says?

Now, as for NTSC-PAL, Transfer....This varispeed is actually 4.272% up from NTSC speed. 4.1 is reference to Film. (and to be technical it's 4.1666%), not 4.1) ProTools addresses this as Up 4%, Up .1%, which is a bit misleading, but simpler to visualize... do the math and it beomes clear (24x4.16666=25).

[Eric L]

So in response to Digibill, slow Pal is cool video guy way to say, work with your PAL speed audio in a pulled down session to match the NTSC video. Pulled down by how much? See the thread above.

This way, the post transfer house (or whomever does the printmaster) can simply remove the pulldown and all should play in sync with the PAL masters.

If the quicktime from FCP is 25f pal, then I'm not sure why you would need to do any of this? Just work to the quicktime.

Unless there is more info that we are not being told, this is what should work.

[Eric L]

yeah, i remember that one as it was me who got you guys to correct me.... but what is the difference between what you are saying and what todd says?

The only difference is the direction we are going. Check out the last paragraph of the Pulldown math thread...

By the way, the biggest mistake I see people make is assuming that, for example, 25 to 24 is -4% change so 24 to 25 must be a +4% change. When one does the math it becomes immediately clear that this is an incorrect conclusion to come to. But it always seems to fluster people anyway. Math rules the universe.

The percentage must be different. The ratio of 24 to 25 can not be the same as the ratio of 25 to 24!

[minister]

GOT IT! thank you!