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#1
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Plug In Latencies?
Does anyone have an up-to-date list of the various plug-in latencies? Command-clicking on the volume thingie is basically useless, aside from the Digi plugs and the few cooperative third-party guys.
Thanks, all... ------------------ Eric Bazilian/The Mousetrap "Music Is Good"
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First the Ecstacy....then the Laundry |
#2
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Re: Plug In Latencies?
if I'm not mistaking if you press command-and then click on the volume reading in the edit window it will switch to reading sample latency from your plugs. Sorry if that was confusing.-mike
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#3
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Re: Plug In Latencies?
or maybe it's option or control. I'm not at my box right now.
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#4
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Re: Plug In Latencies?
Yes, thanks.....please observe that the second sentence in my post was referring to the fact that many of the third-party plugs do NOT support the command-click on the volume fader box. I do know that there is a list somewhere out there of the various latencies...perhaps someone can enlighten???
------------------ Eric Bazilian/The Mousetrap "Music Is Good"
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First the Ecstacy....then the Laundry |
#5
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Re: Plug In Latencies?
Eric's right. I have found the phase indicator to be slightly inaccurate at times. Using a phase meter has proven this to be true.
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#6
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Re: Plug In Latencies?
Not only is the "phase meter not always right", but a lot of the third-party plugs out there are NOT supported by the "command-click" method. I know from experience that Bomb Factory is not, nor is DuY...I think Waves is, but not sure. Somewhere on this group SOMEONE posted a pretty comprehensive list of the real latencies, but after scouring the archives I can't seem to find it.
------------------ Eric Bazilian/The Mousetrap "Music Is Good"
__________________
First the Ecstacy....then the Laundry |
#7
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Re: Plug In Latencies?
I have the same question, but this time for PTLE systems. I have tried Ctrl-clicking, and the numbers change (there are 3 modes, it seems...one volume, the other one I imagine samples, and the other one phase??? There was a negative infinite sign), so I guess it might work the same. Not sure though and really tired right now to make my brain go back to work. Does anyone know where that infamous list that Eric's talking about is?
Juergen "Damn right" |
#8
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Re: Plug In Latencies?
the command click works on my Bombfactory LA2A and 1176 plugs!
and also the 3 displays are: fader value (volume)-peak value(your negative reading-not phase)- and samples of latency. |
#9
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Re: Plug In Latencies?
The feature you describe is provided by Pro Tools with indirect input from the plug-in.
All plug-ins return the number of samples they delay the signal in their algorithms. Most modern plugins (anything that supports MIX) should provide an accurate count. If the count is wrong, notify the developer. It's a bug. All Bomb Factory TDM plug-ins delay the signal one (1) sample. We report it to Pro Tools as such. What Pro Tools does with this information seems to vary according to the machine, DSP manager version, and hardware involved. I've seen these lists and I'm not sure I agree with what people are claiming the numbers are in various plug-ins (not just ours). Some EQ implementations delay the signal differently depending on how many bands are enabled. I've never seen this differentiated in a list. In many cases, additional delays are caused by the phase response of the algorithm with regards to an specific signal. In general, you shouldn't tinker with that, and use what the designer intended unless you're going for a specific effect. For example, our Moog delay has "additional delay" due to the Moog analog filters. I'm sure somebody, somewhere will say that it has "X" samples of delay based on their test file. Nope, there's only one sample of algorithmic/processing delay. Trust me. If you shift it back X samples you're changing the sound. Maybe it's right for the track, but it's not going to match the real-world Moog behavior. (That said, always do what sounds best, not what's "right.") But consider this: Process a track 50/50 wet/dry and listen to the sound. Now dupe the original track, shift it back X samples to "correct" it, and process it 100% wet. Listen to the two tracks together. There's a difference. Now which one is "right"? I say it's the first one. Don't split stereo tracks across interfaces, don't use mono effects on stereo pairs, and limit your use of processing in general on tracks where leakage (or intentional secondary pickup like room mics) is a key component of the overall sound. That's the time-proven way to prevent these sorts of problems. If you make these mistakes, no amount of digital diddling will get you back to optimal--there's way more going here than you can correct for with simple time shifting. There are FREQUENCY DOMAIN effects, not just TIME DOMAIN (delay) effects. In short: different frequencies are arriving at different times. There's no one delay value that's right. Thus any time shifting should be done by ear, not by chart. And in my opinion, it's best avoided. --Erik Bomb Factory - Digital Done Right www.bombfactory.com |
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