Protools 8

[guitardom]

Originally Posted by Sherbert99

I hear you but that's not what I meant. I know an HD 32bit system is what they use but the point is not everyone can spend $10,000 on a 32bit HD system, but they can spend $3000 on a 64 bit system with great processing capabilities and more RAM. It's very hard to record at 88.2 if you are stuck on a 32 bit system and running out of resources. Plus there are awsome effects on HD systems that they can't make for LE systems because LE systems can't handle the processing of them, but 64 bit systems might be able to. With a 64 bit version I know I wont be disappointed because I wont keep running out of RAM like I am now and I will be able to use more of my plugins at once.

Software engineers know that companies should always stay on top of leading edge technology when developing/upgrading software if they wanna stay ahead. 64 bit has been out for years so it's time to at least start getting the ball rolling.

not to bag you, i would love to be able to access more ram myself, a bfd2 junkie, check out the thread on here about accessing more ram, it works!! plus as a side note, hd users cannot use this fix, does not work, so guys like x9 cannot benefit from this, which sucks cause he is a MAJOR vi user.

but for your info, our le systems on modern computers have more processing power than a tdm system could even begin to handle. there is no reason why these plugs you speak of cannot be ported for le. reasearch how many tdm chips some of these plugs use! it is crazy, the motorola chips they use are MASSIVELY outdated compared to our current computers.

when the hd systems were released i was running tdm systems on macs at work and my personal system was just upgraded to a 3.2 p4!!!!! and it was as fast as i could get!!!!! look how far our computers have came!!! the tdm chips have not been updated, they just try to fit a few more on a card! our le systems can handle it on a proper computer, manufactures just are not giving in to us. imagine how much cheaper the chips are nowadays, yet prices have never come down on them??? probably still expensive cause the manufacture has to keep legacy gear around to produce them!!!!!!!

i among others can track at 88.2 with almost no latency without any probs (on our measly 32 bit os). plus with tdm minimum latency is 128 samples, le on pc is 64 samples. though i have heard some say it seems less on a hd??

the only probs with bfd 2 anyway i have is when using afj which is 256 vel layers, double most bfd expansions. i can easily drop a few velocity layers and fix most probs. but i mix MASSIVE sessions, TONS of plugs and with my current intel machine, i dont think i could run out of power for plugs, and i LOVE fx!! remember bfd 2 has offline rendering capabilities, so easy to render drum tracks and pull them in my session. no routing to aux's and all that crap. if i need more, export midi, open a new session, pull in my saved session of bfd 2, quickly render my session, pull the tracks into my current mix session, aprox 10 min. not ideal but works, quick fix for MOST probs, not all of course. then i can keep adding my delays and phasers in my session

other than ram limitations lifted, i cannot imagine any benefits?? i picture the first year of true 64 compatibility a complete disaster for us. between new software, stupidity, plugin incompatibility, complete disaster.

if your mixes are ok now, they will still be ok with 64 bit!! it wont be a turd polisher!

[Sherbert99]

Originally Posted by DigiTechSupt

Don't get me wrong - I know that more RAM access is needed, I'm just wondering why there's the attitude of desperate need, like nothing can be done until it happens.

It's not like we're not working on it or that we don't understand that it's important to do so as quickly as possible, it just seems some are falling into that common trap of 'bigger, faster, more' will somehow solve all their problems. Sure, 64 bit will solve some of them, but it's not like you can't get anything done in the meantime.

For me and I think for many others it's probably not just about solving problems, it's about wanting to "expand and do more". And I think that is the key thing Digi doesn't realize. It stops people from being as creative as they feel they could be when recording.

Like x9blade says "Modern plugins" require more RAM. Plugins are requiring more resources everyday and when people see plugins improving and the host application just standing still for years not taking advantage of new technology that it could be, they get frustrated and angry. They see the plugins having the ability to do something but they can't do it because Pro Tools wont let them since it still has old architecture.

When digi implemented the use of core processor technology that was a major plus, my performance doubled. I can see 64 bit doing the same. But now it just feels they are taking their time with 64 bit technology and didn't prepare properly for it.

[guitardom]

When digi implemented the use of core processor technology that was a major plus, my performance doubled. I can see 64 bit doing the same.

i am afraid you are hoping for way to much. the only doubling you will see, and it is a LOT more than doubling is the idling ram usage of your machine, about 130 mb on a current xp machine and about 1 gb on a vista machine!!!!

sounds like you need to look at your current machine and not focusing on "what could be" and the "if" of it all. most of what you say has nothing to do with a 32 or 64 bit os.

http://duc.digidesign.com/showthread.php?t=212853

this thead is a big fix, gain over a gb of ram usage.

[Sherbert99]

Thanks, Yeah I know BFD2 is a major hog especially at 88.2. I'm ok if I disable some of my kit pieces but I'd like to just have them all readily available. It sounds stupid I know but it's just something I wish I didn't have to do. I've run many tests and have tweaked it out to run the best I can. It's workable for sure it's just once in a while I'll get a pop or something and get annoyed. I better go before I stir up trouble. Now I know someone is gonna say 88.2 is no better then 44.1. I don't wanna get into that : )

Windows Vista Ultimate 32 bit
Dell Precision T5400
Intel Xeon X5450 3.00GHz (2 Physical Processors) (Quad core each)
2x 300GB Velociraptor Drives (10,000 RPM)

[guitardom]

honestly this thread has been very well manored compared to many that go this route. just trying to inform, blame gets put sometimes where it does not belong, typically on digi's back when does not need to be...................cannot believe i just defended them!!

we all agree we want more ram!! but there some simple solutions for us le guys that is great! takes care of most all of my bfd probs. about 550 mb of ram for system and ptle, so leaves around 2 gb of ram for bfd and plugs, typically plenty.

the plug issue is up to the manufacter, we still got plugs that are mac only?? no reason why? just is, same with tdm only plugs. cpu power also has a lot of the bearing also on how many plugs we can access, not just ram. seems to be forgotten a bit, overshadowed by ram.

sound quality?? that is our converters that dictate that part of the process more than the computer ever can.

if a computer has probs tracking at 88.2 with a 32 bit os will be even worse on a 64 bit os! computer needs upgraded!

our time will come, hopefully sooner than later, but been a pt user for almost 10 years, cant just walk away now

oh yea and we would all like more ram availability

[filosofem]

Originally Posted by DigiTechSupt

Don't get me wrong - I know that more RAM access is needed, I'm just wondering why there's the attitude of desperate need, like nothing can be done until it happens.

Granted, however thee alternative is painful to say the least.

A current Windows-based LE system has a RAM ceiling of 1.7 GB (excluding the 3GB Large Address Aware Patch) and instaniating A.I.R. group's very own Strike with 'Unlimited' Content presents a Content Loading Error. So the alternative is to Bus Record and Inactivate, thus you're forced to cycle losing time, patience and creativity for any minor event edit. There's no way you can keep within the non-destructive environment, currently.

And thanks for sharing that you're aware of the issue and acknowledging that steps are being taken to rectify.








filosofem

[x9blade]

another senerio
working with a client in a creative mode,open a vi again modern vi session crash,client gives you a dirty look ................ heres the other problem when you have a large amount of plug ins, protools takes such a long time to open(not saying thats anyones fault)
so, here you were in a creative mode to have protools crash. 4 minutes later your back to where you were.session opens now with your new vi.strange how it crashed the system 4 minutes ago.
start working again maybe change a patch or add another "modern vi"
oh noooooooooooooooo crash again client is like repeat this cycle a few more times till you give up on using vi's in this session.end of day

whatever it takes 64 bit 32 bit os just give us more ram acess

once again ,this does not happen all the time and sure there are always workarounds but c'mon lets get things more stable please .

i have an hd 3 system and the chips are way underpowered compared to todays computers but i look at it this way...... i have all the benifits of hd and a pretty modern computer to handle rtas the best of both worlds but, at a major price

a modern computer will out power my hd 3 system without sweating.thats not a bash its reality. more ram access and more stability then all the fluff of protools 8

p.s. if protools can't ever get to running several moden rtas vi's in a session then please give us midi to audio rendering this way we can kinda quicly bounce our vi tracks to audio and make them inactive and move on

[x9blade]

great points steve. arron, if i ony waited a few more minutes i would't have had to be the on to whine

[filosofem]

You're forgiven Ray.

Yeah, an interim solution to this RAM awareness issue would be a MIDI to Audio render function, very good point.






filosofem

[guitardom]

leave it up to aaron and ray to turn any subject into a midi driven diatribe!!!!!!!!!!

ray: guess it would be helpful considering you'll have omnishpere running on EVERYTHING now, but sounds killer so what the heck?

would be a rockin feature to have at our disposal though!