Mix plus with control surface or HD2 with a mouse?

[WannabeSQ]

I am trying to price and put together a potential system of my own in case I leave the studio I am at. Is a control surface that much better for post editing and mixing? I currently do not use one, and only use a mouse (low budget studio) so I am leaning towards the HD system, for continued updates, and more power. I am trying to keep it less than $15000, for just about everything, except the computer, I have a dual g4 1.42ghz with a Digi 001 (soon to be moved to another computer for editing)

[Mubeau]

hi!
simple answer:
NO WAY MIXING A FILM, Music WITH A MOUSE !!
Have you ever tried to mix 2 tracks at the same time with the mouse?
What do you really plan to do? ADR, mixing, recording?

I´d say:
Stay with your G4 (it´s fast enough), build in quiet fans, use a video card, genlock/WC, buy a control surface (one with touch faders!) and go for a used (!) Mix system and perhaps a used Control24... they are quite "cheap" at the moment.
If you don´t do mixes for 5.1 a Mix3 system should be aboluteley enough for the moment and upgrade later but I´d really recommend buying plug ins and other stuff needed. Monitors ???

cheers!
m.

[Bhobson]

Mubeau wrote: "NO WAY MIXING A FILM, Music WITH A MOUSE !!
Have you ever tried to mix 2 tracks at the same time with the mouse?"

Trust his words. I do small and feature independant films on my personal LE system, and i used to mix the stuff with a mouse. I recently bought a Tascam FW-1884, and I will never, EVER regret it. It makes the whole process smoother and much easier. Mixing with a mouse is a bad choice when it comes to doing real work, it does not compare to any control surface. Sure, it can be done, but i wouldnt do it willingly anymore, thats for sure!!!!! Definitely go for the control surface in your new package, you will never look back.

[JR Fountain]

A little aside, but I'm also looking into getting a control surface. Anybody use the CM Labs MotorMate? What's it like? So far it's the only small control surface I've seen that will do automation switching for each channel which I would think would be pretty handy to have. Not sure why Command8 doesn't have this.

Thanks,
JR

[Mubeau]

hi!

I used the motormix in my sounddesign room, some years ago. (Was exchanged by a control24).
Basically it worked fine, but didnt have touch fader, which is really not perfect for continuous mixing. Motormate will be a lot better in this case.
What I didnt like about the motormix were those tiny little rubber "data" wheels: much too small.

Mackie Control will be also a "cheap" and good solution; or the new 24 Track Tascam (which i don´t know, but it´s a good price for 24 faders !).

"Totally off topic": I even programmed a Novation Remote25 for my portable Mix Protools system for doing a bit of music during my holidays... no I´m not a mouse ))

Since this is possible, I assume that any programmeable midi interface will be fine with protools.
And since they are not so expensive anymore it´s more or less a matter of taste, I think.

cheers,
Mubeau

[WannabeSQ]

I guess I have just gotten complacent, and been content with a mouse. I usually end up writing automation with the edit window rather than move the virtual faders. I mostly do editing for post production, so the control surface has less need there. I can definately see the benefits of having the control surface. The Control 24 looks perfect for me, as it has mic pres built in, are they good enough for basic foley/ADR recording? I was looking at the octopre, and cost wise, the Control 24 makes more sense. I saw a good deal on ebay for a Mix 3 system, with 888 and 1622, and I added up the digidesign exchange price, and it would actually be cheaper to buy the mix system, then immediately trade up to the HD system, something like $6000 cheaper than the list price. Speaking of list, is that pretty much the best deal out there for new equipment? Kinda like how Apple closely controls pricing, so nobody's got real deals, just free extras.

I kinda dig the surround panners on the Pro Control, should I look into that? I would like to get into surround pre-mixing, and mastering at a proper dub stage.

Coming from a no control surface environment, I don't like the idea of spending so much on something like that. Are there any good alternatives for simple fader automation? I guess my biggest problem with the mouse is automating EQs and compressors, can't touch more than one knob. Do any control surfaces allow me to control the plugin's paramaters? That's what I really need. If it's not too expensive, I would much rather have a HD1 at least, if not HD2 Accel.

Thanks for the input so far. Any other tips for going freelance and trying to make a living? I like the studio aspect because I get regular (albeit low, i'm basically making paid intern rates now) but I hate seeing so much money paid for service I do go to fund the rest of the company, while I make $275 a week. I have been looking for other employment, but have come up dry, or they want 3 years plus experience, where I only have a bit under 2. Freelance from home appeals to me the most, I only worry about job security, and being able to pay off the equipment I buy.

[martian]

i bought that FW1884 too and it's been great! mixing with faders is the only way to go!!!!!!

[Roy Pahlman]

I use a Pro Control here and really like it. The ability to flip the faders to control plug in paramaters is a really great feature, and the faders feel pretty nice. No mic pres on Pro Control though.

[jimlongo]

You can do that with the Command8 as well. Very cost effective control surface option. I got one after mouse mixing for years and it's like night and day.

[Mubeau]

hi wannabesq,

i wouldnt recommend the Procontrol, if you have to keep price in mind!
because you only get 8 fades... if you really think about mixing, these are still too few.
2 advantages of the procontrol though: looks cool and you can add more faders... but they also
cost $$$$.

Believe me: DO NOT THINK ABOUT letting a director in a room with NO faders, insisting that you do mixes... ))

For Foleys and ADR preamps are ok (and way above 50$ crap), but dont´think about recording "high end" symphonic music with it )
One thing: monitoring through the C24 is possible, but not good, since you have volume "steps" (how should one set up exact ref levels with that?)... and
"a big bang when you turn on your C24"...

Im looking forward to my new ICON

cheers,
Mubeau