What's it going to take to get Eucon to follow Nuendo?

[KeyplayerG]

Granted, you CAN get a lot of mileage out of the Artist Series and, now, the S3. But the MAJOR REQUEST from all non PT users for both items, is TO HAVE THE HARDWARE MATCH THE DAW SCREEN!

It is a major hassle not having the hardware hide/show tracks to match the DAW! The few work-arounds available (like making Layouts linked to Visibility Agents) diminishes a considerable amount of resources and requires hours and hours of programming just to come close.

What will it take to get this one essential feature?

[J-S-Q]

I would love to know the answer to this!

It seems that the ball is in Steinberg's court. They were rumoured to have this feature working in an internal version of Cubase a couple of years ago but it has never been released. Such a shame.

[KeyplayerG]

Originally Posted by J-S-Q

I would love to know the answer to this!

It seems that the ball is in Steinberg's court. They were rumoured to have this feature working in an internal version of Cubase a couple of years ago but it has never been released. Such a shame.

This feature works in PT, right? Is that the ONLY way we can have this work? This doesn't make sense to me. The entire draw of Eucon (at least when it was under the Euphonix Flag) was that this hardware worked with ALL DAWS, thus never having to change your work flow because it made all controls the same regardless of what you're controlling! So to have some stuff work on some DAWS and not on others seems antithetical to the original "mission statement!"

[J-S-Q]

Yes, but it's down to each DAW company to implement the features.

e.g. In Cubase/Nuendo, you have custom plugin parameter mapping which you don't have in Pro Tools. That's a huge plus BUT not being able to hide tracks is a huge minus!

[KeyplayerG]

See, here's the thing. I was able to develop a partial work around for this issue.
Nuendo has "Visibility Agents." You get 8 of them that you can store as presets. You and have a lot more than that. But, for some odd reason, Steinberg will only allow the one button preset storage of 8. But that's another discussion.

Bottom line is that these Visibility Agents work pretty much like Eucon Layouts. So, you can store any combination of tracks that you want to see and store them for recall at the touch of a button.

My work-around was to write and store 8 Macros and marrying 8 hardware layouts that mirror those 8 Visibility Presets in Nuendo 8. So now, for the most part, when I'm in normal "All Tracks" mode, my 20 Fader Artist series units follow the DAW, with the only issue being that the hardware doesn't see folders. Annoying, but no big deal.

When I need to look at one of those Visibility Presets now, I push one button and the hardware now matches the DAW exactly! When I'm done, I push the Clear button and snap back to normal "All Tracks" mode and the hardware still matches the DAW.

That covers about 85% of my work flow. The last 15% is the chaos that comes from the hardware NOT MATCHING the DAW, like when I open a "chain (show all tracks connected to this track)" or if I need to do a quick reference on a couple of tracks for a few minutes. The DAW shows the tracks side by side. But the hardware shows one fader for one of the tracks while the other fader might br 30 faders away, to the left or right, and not showing on the hardware at all. That is flat out unworkable!

For those moments, I have to work as if I don't have a controller at all.

My point is this. I'm a composer, NOT a programmer. If I can get within 85% of nominal with a few macros, WHY can't the developers get me the rest of the way right out of the box? I get the "budget gear" thing. You don't get displays with valuable feedback like you would on S6/5-MC, Nuage or Tango. You don't get hardware with screens that allow you to read it like a traditional mixer and not have to look at the DAW. But it's BECAUSE you don't get those things that the hardware/DAW synchronization factor is critical!!!! The DAW IS all the feedback you'll get! So, you'll need the hardware to control what you're seeing on screen. Without that synchronization, this is very difficult.

With that being the case, THIS IS A MUST HAVE FEATURE! People driving a Prius still expect a windshield steering wheel and gas pedal, just like you'd get with the Rolls-Royce. You just don't get all of the luxury items. To me, the DAW/Hardware synchronization feature is the same as that "windshield" and, without it, you're driving blind or at least severely limited to how much wind the naked eye can take during travel.

[BScout]

You should really go complain to Steinberg as J-S-Q pointed out.

It's up to them to implement things.

[KeyplayerG]

Originally Posted by BScout

You should really go complain to Steinberg as J-S-Q pointed out.

It's up to them to implement things.

Yeah, been there, done that. It's the old "Ping Pong Game" between the 2.

[etl17]

Hi KeyplayerG,

I am also a Nuendo user thinking about purchasing the S3. Out of all the $5K options, it seems to be the most feature complete surface. However, I wonder if the Eucon protocol implementation for Nuendo is really up-to-snuff with, let's say, the PT implementation and depth of integration.

Would you recommend the S3 for use with Nuendo, or I should rather look into other options?

[KeyplayerG]

Originally Posted by etl17

Hi KeyplayerG,

I am also a Nuendo user thinking about purchasing the S3. Out of all the $5K options, it seems to be the most feature complete surface. However, I wonder if the Eucon protocol implementation for Nuendo is really up-to-snuff with, let's say, the PT implementation and depth of integration.

Would you recommend the S3 for use with Nuendo, or I should rather look into other options?

I'm not using an S3. I don't like the 16 fader limitation. I'm still using a 20 fader Artist Series (1 MC & 2 Mix) rigg. They keep promising to make S3's cascadable. WHEN that actually happens, I'll seriously consider moving to a 2 S3/Dock configuration. Until then, there's no motivation for me to switch.

[J-S-Q]

Originally Posted by etl17

Hi KeyplayerG,

I am also a Nuendo user thinking about purchasing the S3. Out of all the $5K options, it seems to be the most feature complete surface. However, I wonder if the Eucon protocol implementation for Nuendo is really up-to-snuff with, let's say, the PT implementation and depth of integration.

Would you recommend the S3 for use with Nuendo, or I should rather look into other options?

The integration with Cubase/Nuendo is excellent. I'd say definitely better than any other controller unless you're getting a Nuage or S6. BUT you have to be able to live with the hiding channels issue discussed in this thread and also the issue whereby you get slight errors in volume when you bank through tracks and then touch a fader. I think these are really the only BIG issues that you need to be aware of.