Mac G4 versus G5 versus Windows XP

[froyo]

Hello. To further focus in my point, it is actually in TDM systems that your chicken and egg scenario plays out. Because if you have the cash to spend for a TDM system, wouldn't you then want to have the option of all these plug ins? To put it another way, why spend upwards of $12K or $15K, and not be able to buy McDsp, GRM, etc? You will also be stuck with other Mac only things, like DV through Firewire, etc. It is then that the dynamic plays out as you mentioned. No one wants to buy PC TDM because of the lack of plug ins, and plug in manufacturers will not develop for a market that doesn't exist.

[progress88]

Thanks for the feedback guys,

I have been using PC's for years. And, I have been hearing for years that macs couldn't be beat for music and video applications. So I was really surprised when the majority of the responses I received were in favor of the PC platform. The main reasons were: better value for the money, both in building the system, and upgrading the system, but that I already knew. I was really searching for the reason that a lot of people swear by the mac. I thought it was because of higher performance. But, the main reasons I heard were: no compatibility problems, ease of use, and that most studios use macs. However, I now find that most studios are running both platforms, and as someone mentioned earlier, the people complaining about ease of use haven't used a PC since windows 95! In searching the thread " Best System for PTLE for Under $1000.00 " It states that "a PC based AMD or P4 system has achieved 100% better performance than a G4 system". I took the recommendations for the original system listed, changed a couple of things, and designed a system for under $950.00 (including keyboard and mouse)that is already proven to give excellent performance.
There are some Plug ins for the Mac that are not available on the PC platform yet, but I''m sure they are coming. Let's face it, I purchased PTLE because it allows me to my songwriting and recording without selling the car and breaking the bank. I can always take all my work to a major studio, dump everything to their HD system, and use their 100k+ system and plug ins for mastering, if it came to that.. That same idea for value is what makes people go for the PC instead of the MAC. With the increase in the use of PTLE for the PC's, soon every plug in should be available in both platforms.
So for now, I'll save $2000.00 and use the PC platform. I had my eye on a new board anyway ............ Mike

AMD XP2500 + Barton FSB333
Micron 512MB Pc2700 DDR Sdram
2 - Western digital 120MB HD with 8MB cache
1 - Western Digital 80MB HD with 2MB cache
dvd, cdrw, dual video card 64MB, etc,etc..............

[froyo]

By progress88

There are some Plug ins for the Mac that are not available on the PC platform yet, but I''m sure they are coming...With the increase in the use of PTLE for the PC's, soon every plug in should be available in both platforms.

Hello. I think you may have missed the point of my two posts above. This simply is not the case at the moment. PT LE for PC's is already a bigger market than LE for Mac, or at the very least the same size. The issue for the Mac only plug in developers for the most part are TDM systems which just do not sell on PC. Check in the Windows LE forum for a thread called RTAS Petition and RTAS Petition Follow Up. Basically it outlines the situation to detail.

To sum up, the majority of these Mac only plug ins will probably not be PC any time soon, if ever. So if you are basing a purchase hoping these will be out next year or so, you are in for a rude awakening. If you buy a PC system, buy it with the knowledge that these will probably never be available. If it does happen (highly improbable) then it will be gravy, but do not base a purchase under those conditions, or you will probably be severely disappointed.

As for the performance issue, the G5's will probably make some headway in catching up as far as muscle and speed. AMD's Clawhammer is around the corner also, but the issue remains that the G5's will far outperform G4's.

[progress88]

I understand your point, but are the plug ins that your referring to reasonably priced, extremely useful programs, or the very expensive, high end items that only someone running a HD system might be interested in? Are those plug ins something only a commerical recording studio will find as a neccessity? I will check out that thread, thanks..........mike

[kmshroom]

I was really searching for the reason that a lot of people swear by the mac. I thought it was because of higher performance.

the opposite is true. PCs have much more processing power than Macs.

a while back, when PCs were like 300 mhz machines, macs were indeed much faster than PCs. but since then, that is not the case. the 2nd or 3rd generation of G5s may change this, but then again, AMD is countering with clawhammer, so the jury is still out.

[gerax]

OK

How many plug-ins do you really need to get work done?

Yes, the present situation tells us that more plug-ins are available for the Mac platform, anyway, to do a little math:

Digiracks (quite a few plugs thrown in with PT)
Maxim
SoundReplacer
Lo-Fi
Recti-fi
Sci-fi
Vari-fi
D-Verb
Waves Bundle (Gold or Platinum, again, this isn't just one plug-in, its' many...)
Waves Masters Bundle
Waves Restoration Bundle
Bomb Factory Bundle (that includes all of the Compressors, EQs, Tech21, and Moog effect, etc..)
Focusrite D2 and D3
Serato Pitch and Time
TC Speed
Sony Oxford Inflator
Synchro Arts Vocalign
Antares Autotune
Antares Tube
Antares Kantos
IK Multimadia SampleTaknk
IK Multimedia Amplitube
Sonic Timeworks Bundle

I'm sure I'm forgetting others...

I think if you cannot get your work done with these "few" plug ins then it's not the plug-ins developer or Digi's fault, it's yours. I work every day withe these and they almost cover all of my processing needs; I threw in a pair of hardware reverbs (Lexicon and Eventide) and a few hardware dynamics (TL Audio, dbX) and the trick is done.

Pro Tools on PC is relatively young, but I see the trend is turning from all Mac to 50/50 Mac PC, and obviously third party developers will have to adapt.
The biggest ones (Waves, BF...) already did, there may be a few minor hardcore developers that will stick to the Mac only politics, but if you use Pro Tools just for that particular plug in, then again it's not Digi's or the developer's fault.

Cheers

L.G.

[kmshroom]

gerax, i agree to only a certain extent. i am on the PC platform using PTLE, and i can get work done. esp. signal processors, we have 'enough.' sure, i'd like the McDSP Analog Channel, but you are correct, one can get work done without it, esp. since we do have the complete Waves available.

when I think about the weak RTAS PC platform, i am predominantly thinking about soft synths.

we have SampleTank, B4, Moog Modular, kantos.

THAT'S IT (at the current moment).

we don't even have a sampler!!! omg. life is ..more inconvenient than it should be.

we don't have all THREE amazing spectrasonics stuff, Mach V, Ultimate Sound Bank, and i could really go on for a while.

rewire helps things, i know, but just think RTAS only for a minute, and look how pitiful the RTAS PC platform is with regards to soft synths/samplers.

[gerax]

Kmshroom

I see your point and I agree.

Then again I want to stress the fact that Pro Tools on PC is relatively youg, and though we can have great expectations from it, we have to let developers and manufacturers catch up, and realize that now the PC is a viable solution to audio production; a few years ago Macs were the only choice for serious production, nowdays you have more choices; it's quite natural that, coming from an all-Mac past, developers have the majority of their products written for that platform, but to me it's not the case to just complain about the lack of this or that...we can be more active, write to the manufacturers and tell them.."hey, we're here as well!" I think that if we make our voice loud enough changes will happen, even Digi after seeing all of the requests of PC users has finally come to (almost) parity.

If you just want to complain ...think about those using Linux

Cheers

L.G.

[froyo]

Hello. Gerax that was the point of that whole RTAS petition. A bunch of people e-mailed plug in manufacturers. What we were basically told as a response from them is don't hold your breath.

[hydrafonic]

I am in the same exact dilemma. I am inclined to go with a mac, but damn they are considerably more expensive. My scenario is I would like to get into an 002 with LE and I figure since most "pros" that use pro tools go mac, I will too. At the same time, it seems many feel that the PC platform is catching up very, very, quickly to the mac platform. So what does a newbie to pro tools do? What gives?