Bwf = rf64

[EdgarRothermich]

I looked through the forum regarding this topic and it seems that PT supports the RF64 Audio File Format since PT10. However, the Session Setup window doesn't provide the RF64 option, only the "BWF (.WAV)" option.
My understanding is that the WAV is the original format (limit to max 4GB) and the BWF format was an extension to include various metadata. The RF64 format, another extension, then provided the increase in file size beyond 4GB (among many other things)

Does that mean that Pro TOols automatically creates a RF64 audio file once the audio file increases beyond 4GB or what is the deal here?

[EdgarRothermich]

Sorry to bump that up, but I thought this should be an easy one for someone to clarify.
Anybody?

[kelsey]

Why not setup a 192k session, hit record and go to lunch. When you come back see what file you have? I'm guessing it will automatically split the files and not create an RF64.
Everything I have read about PT support for RF64 refers to importing and using it in a track, which has always left me with the impression that it does not record to RF64. However I have not confirmed this with a test.

https://wanderingear.net

[EdgarRothermich]

Originally Posted by kelsey

Why not setup a 192k session, hit record and go to lunch. When you come back see what file you have? I'm guessing it will automatically split the files and not create an RF64.
Everything I have read about PT support for RF64 refers to importing and using it in a track, which has always left me with the impression that it does not record to RF64. However I have not confirmed this with a test.

Funny thing you mentioned that because I did exactly that, twice. However, when I came back from lunch, PT crashed, twice.
I did that on my old MacBook, so I will try it again on my iMac and report back.

[EdgarRothermich]

I recorded a Track and PR kept on going. I stopped when the new audio file was around 6GB. So I guess that proves that " "BWF (.WAV)" means RF64.

However, here is an interesting observation. When I try to open that 6GB wav file into the WaveAgent app, it didn't let me. It acted as it doesn't know the file type (like dragging in an aiff file. Any other (smaller) wav file that I recorded in PT will open in WaveAgent. Could that mean that PR automatically turns a "standard" wave file into a RF64 type file once it grows larger than 4GB.

That would mean that looking at an audio file with the file extension .wav doesn't say anything about the actual file type, it could be a Wav, BWF, or RF64 and you have to "look inside" the file to find out.
If I open that file with TextEditor, then the first line shows "RF64ˇˇˇˇWAVEds64‹Ω∑
¶Db
q"

This is very confusing. Even the PT reference guide couldn't make up its mind if the wav file type is limited to 2GB or 4GB.

Now I'm really curious if anybody on this forum has a bit more information about that

[kelsey]

Interesting. Good to know PT will automatically create an RF64 if the recording goes over. Hopefully this is an optional feature as not all programs support RF64.

There are some things you need to understand about the WAV file format that will help with some of your confusion. First, BWF does not mean RF64. They are different extensible versions of a WAV file.

Since WAV files are a chunk file format, additional data of any type (like application specific metadata) can be added to the file in a "chunk" and if a program doesn't recognize the chunk or know what to do with it it will ignore it. BEXT and iXML are examples of "chunks" that are standardized separately from the WAV format, the combination of these chunks within a WAV file makes that file a BWF (Broadcast WAV).

When you opened your file in a text or hex editor, you saw the first 4 characters were RF64. On a standard WAV file that would be RIFF. The next 4 bytes (32 bits) are an unsigned integer that represents the length of the file.

Since WAV files store their length as a 32 bit integer, the maximum value that can be stored ends up with a file around 4gb. RF64 adds a new chunk that includes the 64bit representation of the file length allowing for much much larger files to be created, but the receiving software must know how to read and interpret that new chunk of data.

If you add the BWF metadata to a RF64 file, it is called a MBWF. And no, I don't know what the "M" refers to. Why it's not BWF64???? I don't know, but I'm sure someone had a reason.

Hope that helps.



https://wanderingear.net

[EdgarRothermich]

Thank you kelsey for this technical information.

I still found it strange that this RF64 capability is not really pointed out, neither in the selectable options nor any mention in the reference guide.

[arche3]

My head hurts.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

[BScout]

Originally Posted by EdgarRothermich

Thank you kelsey for this technical information.

I still found it strange that this RF64 capability is not really pointed out, neither in the selectable options nor any mention in the reference guide.

It's not selectable because it writes a standard BWF until it needs to write a larger file than what a standard BWF can handle and then modifies the header chunk to make it a RF64 file.

What would be the point of making any of this selectable? Would you select RF64 for files that don't need it (under the size limit)? Would you want a standard BWF for files that do need to be RF64 so Pro Tools stops recording when it runs out of space in the container?

[kelsey]

I would prefer the option to either record an RF64 or automatically split the WAV files.

https://wanderingear.net