Changed input routing since PhoenixVerb Surround v3?

[Frank Kruse]

Hi,

am I the only one bothered about the changed input routing in PhoenixVerb since v3 for mono to 5.0 instances? Up to v2.0.9 on a mono to 5.0 instance the incoming signal to the plugin would arrive on the center channel giving me a balanced wet signal.

However for some reason EA decided on v3 to change this so from that version onwards a mono input comes in on the left channel which leads to reverbs leaning to the left especially with small rooms that have less "smear" than large ones.

I rolled back to v2.0.9 because of this. Am I the only one using mono-5.0 reverbs? Asking because Izotope support sounded a little bit like I should not be doing this (versus using LCR or 5.0 sends) but then I wonder why is there a mono to 5.0 version in the first place. Plus it all was fine before v3 and we've mixed tons of films this way without this issue.

I already talked to a couple of other mixers that stayed at 2.0.9 for this reason.

Anyone know what the reason for this change was? Michael can't be reached anymore via the EA address I guess.

Also: Is this the same in the other flavours of EA reverbs? Same in Stratus, R2 etc.?

Many thanks!

Frank.

[cablenaute]

Same behaviour here with phoenixverb surround, reverb is coming from the left side, I had to change sends to 5.0, quite annoying!!

[smurfyou]

I agree, why have the Mono>5.0 if it doesn't map to center?

[Reckless Erik]

+1

[Farhoof]

Mono sends here also. I don't know why it's changed, but it's stupid and should be reverted. You can put a mono>5.1 Spanner in front as a quick fix and to ensure compatibility with other stages on version 3+.

Changing about 150 sends to 5.1 will eat my dsp, i'll stick to mono thank you very much

[Frank Kruse]

Originally Posted by Farhoof

Mono sends here also. I don't know why it's changed, but it's stupid and should be reverted. You can put a mono>5.1 Spanner in front as a quick fix and to ensure compatibility with other stages on version 3+.

Changing about 150 sends to 5.1 will eat my dsp, i'll stick to mono thank you very much

Exactly! Thank you! The more people raise this with Izotope support the better. They don't seem to consider this as an issue. Putting a Spanner in front of it will null all your automation too and then you have to copy-special it back plus the added DSP power. I hope they can revert this back to how it used to be. The more people ask them about it the better.

Thanks!

Frank.

[tom_lowe]

Originally Posted by Frank Kruse

Exactly! Thank you! The more people raise this with Izotope support the better. They don't seem to consider this as an issue. Putting a Spanner in front of it will null all your automation too and then you have to copy-special it back plus the added DSP power. I hope they can revert this back to how it used to be. The more people ask them about it the better.

Thanks!

Frank.

Is it the same on mono to 5.1 or only 5.0?

[Frank Kruse]

Originally Posted by tom_lowe

Is it the same on mono to 5.1 or only 5.0?

Haven't checked yet, I don't use .1 on reverb returns. Will try when I get a moment.

[tom_lowe]

Originally Posted by Frank Kruse

Haven't checked yet, I don't use .1 on reverb returns. Will try when I get a moment.

I’ve asked a contact about this. I’m going to test with Symphony later.

[Michael Carnes]

Hi folks,
The good Dr. Sound referred me to this one. I can respond, but you won't like the answer. The change in routing is probably not intentional. In all likelihood it's a bug. But it's been the better part of a year since it got cooked into the code. During that last development period I ran an open beta. Too bad it wasn't caught then when I could do something about it. It all likelihood it was collateral damage that came across as I was trying to work around surround issues with other DAWs. I wish I'd caught it. However it happened (and I honestly don't remember), there's not a thing I can do about it right now.

The code is in iZotope's hands now. I'm working with a very capable team to get the IP transferred over. But getting several decade's worth of experience into other heads is not something I can do overnight. Surround routing is one of those things that's quite important to me (you'll never know what at PITA it was to fix problems introduced by other DAWs) but I think it's going to be a while before you see an iZotope-generated release. I'll be working closely with them and will draw their attention to this thread. I'm more than sorry I can't address this with the speed I was once able to. I think that--once they're fully up-to-speed--that iZotope is going to be able to deal with this (and add a few nice new wrinkles as well).

While I've got your ear, keep in mind that the upcoming Catalina release of MacOS is 64-bit only. That's not a problem for the plugins--they've been 64-bit for years. But the installers are 32-bit. This means that--if you update a computer that's already got the plugins installed, then you're fine. If you need to move older plugs to a new Catalina machine, then you'll have to do it by hand. iZotope will be making 64-bit installers of the current releases, but they're not likely to do the same for historical versions.