Delay Compensation bug in PT11 with AOS plug-ins (fixed in PT 11.2.1)

[BigJohnD]

Not sure if this is relevant, but it may have something to do with the ADC issue. It has to do with the demo session that ships with PT 11. Kelly Malone’s ‘Earth and Stars’ – it is a good song. There is an instrument track with the VI Structure on it.

This brought to mind a couple of questions:

1. The demo song would play back nicely in PT 10, but why did it only appear with the PT 11 release? If I remember correctly, Structure 2 was not available yet at the time of PT 11’s initial release. Also, some of the custom sounds that the Structure patches pointed at were not provided with the download – I had to replace them with sounds shipped standard with Structure. The path where Structure was looking for the custom sounds was on somebody’s desktop. Seems a bit sloppy to ship a demo of your premiere product that has missing stuff.

In this demo session, Structure provides a bunch of percussive sounds. The way it is set up, there are no MIDI notes on the instrument track with Structure. However, there are seven MIDI tracks labeled Ratchet, Tapp, Shake, etc. These MIDI tracks all have notes on them and point to the Structure instance on the aforementioned instrument track.

2. I seem to remember that the demo song timing was all screwed up the first time that I played it back on some version of PT 11 (maybe PT 11.0.2, after Structure 2 came out). Now, with PT 11.1.3, it seems to play back correctly, as far as I can tell. At least the percussive sounds provided by Structure 2 sound good and they stay in sync with a click track. (I suppose that it may be possible that they are offset from where they should be, but there is no discernible drift on listening, and like I say, they sound good – enhance the song).

So, I’ll throw this out there: maybe something got fixed between PT version 11.0.2 and 11.1.3. Also, the way the demo session is set up may help some folks avoid the ADC issue, as the MIDI tracks don’t have any plug-ins. They all get the same plug-ins on the Instrument track. However, there is some individual MIDI track control of things like panning, fader volume, velocity, etc. This may be enough to help some folks until a more complete ADC fix is provided by Avid.

[mykhal c]

Originally Posted by BigJohnD

So, I’ll throw this out there: maybe something got fixed between PT version 11.0.2 and 11.1.3. Also, the way the demo session is set up may help some folks avoid the ADC issue, as the MIDI tracks don’t have any plug-ins. They all get the same plug-ins on the Instrument track. However, there is some individual MIDI track control of things like panning, fader volume, velocity, etc. This may be enough to help some folks until a more complete ADC fix is provided by Avid.

an accurate statement...no doubt

[Ghost In The Attic]

Originally Posted by Spaced

Ghostwriter: Nope, HD Native here (I'm a mixer who sold his HD4 rig)

Ah, there is the problem.
HDX has the most problems with Delay Compensation.

[Spaced]

You may well be right (that sucks, considering how much the damn thing costs) Can you open the session using built in audio as the playback engine instead of HDX and see if the problem persists?

I tried the 512 buffer (actual tried them all, from 32 to 1024)- no difference between them other than a slightly increasing processor load as the buffer size falls. The timing of the drums remained unchanged.

[mykhal c]

Originally Posted by Spaced

Does it stay in sync if you load the auxillary instrument tracks with lots of latency inducing plugins? eg 3 or 4 Maxims. Apologies if this is a dumb ass question

Spaced...you and the guys here are dead on-point. once again another workflow has taught me something!!!

so to answer your question..NO it does not stay in sync!! i threw up to 3 Maxims on one channel (top snare) so it would be easy to hear a flam when it compared to bottom snare on another INST track. solo'd the two and sure enough...FLAM!!

BUT all was not lost in my test. i did find a workaround. and maybe you guys have already discussed and posted this...as i haven't read the entire thread.

so as i added more Maxims to the top snare track i noticed the delay compensation was being accurately reported on all tracks in the session. the top snare track would report an additional 1024 samples worth of delay on that track itself and adjust delay comp on the other trax by 1024 samples per Maxim. so on the top snare track in the +/- field i entered the exact 'negative' amount of what ever was reported. 1 Maxim = -1024 in this field...2 Maxims = -2048...3 Maxims = -3072. this work-around kept this track in sync. all the other trax were compensated correctly.

so like guys i'll await a full fix too. i'll make sure Avid gets this info also. good thread!! thanks!

[Spaced]

Thanks for trying that out. At least the results are consistent between VIs.

Have you tried putting the VI on an audio track, MIDI on a MIDI track, returning the audio using aux inputs instead of instrument tracks and force enabling delay compensation on the audio track by control+command clicking the cmp indicator (it will turn blue)?

See if that makes delay compensation work 'automatically'

[Ghost In The Attic]

Originally Posted by Spaced

You may well be right (that sucks, considering how much the damn thing costs) Can you open the session using built in audio as the playback engine instead of HDX and see if the problem persists?

I haven't had a chance to try that, but it wouldn't be of any benefit to me because I need the HDX.

Yes, it does suck to pay this much for HDX and have it be worse than Native.

[damasio]

Aah come on protools!!!
Even when i work in a session and all midi is great. i save it, open it and tadaaa,,, timing is all off. I can't do any professional work with protools, i am very frustrated right now.

[ronwasserman]

Just a quick note for anyone who hasn't tried it. VEP (Vienna Ensemble Pro) Is the answer for composers. I use it for massive setups...not a hiccup in years of use. All 'in the box'....no external computer needed.

[Stig Eliassen]

Originally Posted by ronwasserman

Just a quick note for anyone who hasn't tried it. VEP (Vienna Ensemble Pro) Is the answer for composers. I use it for massive setups...not a hiccup in years of use. All 'in the box'....no external computer needed.

Indeed.