MIDI problem - can anyone replicate?

[midnightrambler]

I'm on 2020.3, 10.14.6, HD Native.

Can anyone see if they can reproduce this on their system please? I'm currently in conversation with AVID Tech support who are being very evasive about whether they can reproduce this problem on their side. Their current suggestion is to "delete Pro Tools prefs"

http://duc.avid.com/showpost.php?p=2562069&postcount=16

[ibbod0]

no issue here unless i turn delay compensation off. sure you haven't turned it off by mistake? i'm on windows btw.

[midnightrambler]

Yeah it's not delay compensation, you can see it's active from the mix window in the video I uploaded. Thanks for checking anyway.

[clutch]

Just replicated your test.
At buffer size of 32 I could record just fine. MIDI lined up as good as I would expect.

Changing to a buffer size of 1024 made the instrument unplayable - the delay was too much for my ears. I found I had to anticipate the note hugely to make it sound even close to in time with the click. Once I muted the record track I continued hitting the keyboard note in time with the click, stopped recording and listened to the result, which was perfect.

[midnightrambler]

Originally Posted by clutch

Just replicated your test.
At buffer size of 32 I could record just fine. MIDI lined up as good as I would expect.

Changing to a buffer size of 1024 made the instrument unplayable - the delay was too much for my ears. I found I had to anticipate the note hugely to make it sound even close to in time with the click. Once I muted the record track I continued hitting the keyboard note in time with the click, stopped recording and listened to the result, which was perfect.

Yes that tallies with my experience of when I switched the playback engine to "ProTools Aggregate" (from Native HD) - a completely unplayable VI.

[innesireinar]

Originally Posted by clutch

Just replicated your test.
At buffer size of 32 I could record just fine. MIDI lined up as good as I would expect.

Changing to a buffer size of 1024 made the instrument unplayable - the delay was too much for my ears. I found I had to anticipate the note hugely to make it sound even close to in time with the click. Once I muted the record track I continued hitting the keyboard note in time with the click, stopped recording and listened to the result, which was perfect.

Exactly. When working at high buffer size you hear latency, to compensate this your brain lets you play earlier, then when playback what you just recorded you hear all out of beat.

[midnightrambler]

So after a week of to'ing and fro'ing the "support" department have now decided this is a feature, not a bug.

"On a recording side, obviously, if you set your buffer size to 1024 you will experience a delay. The higher the amount of buffer size the higher chance of getting a delay during recording. You can just adjust your buffer size to a much higher amount if you are now on mastering the mix."

No explanation as to why there's a delay, whether it happens on all systems or if it's just mine (hint: it almost certainly won't be), why they can't just build in some sort of correction so that MIDI can be played in on ANY buffer size. It's taken a week for them to admit that it just doesn't work as it should, after asking me to waste time doing things like changing the USB cable, deleting prefs, trying a different VI, etc etc.

I'm so angry.

[ZEUSS]

I hate to say it again but Midi needs to be completely overhauled! Its a joke. AVID is the standard in post and film but yet when you try to "compose" or "create" it is bug ridden, cpu spiking and not efficient, sloppy, and just terrible. Embarrassing. And the reality is everyone knows and must use a competitors daw to do it...... How many years now?? Sad But hey! we have folder tracks now.....

[Philthy]

Originally Posted by midnightrambler

So after a week of to'ing and fro'ing the "support" department have now decided this is a feature, not a bug.

"On a recording side, obviously, if you set your buffer size to 1024 you will experience a delay. The higher the amount of buffer size the higher chance of getting a delay during recording. You can just adjust your buffer size to a much higher amount if you are now on mastering the mix."

No explanation as to why there's a delay, whether it happens on all systems or if it's just mine (hint: it almost certainly won't be), why they can't just build in some sort of correction so that MIDI can be played in on ANY buffer size. It's taken a week for them to admit that it just doesn't work as it should, after asking me to waste time doing things like changing the USB cable, deleting prefs, trying a different VI, etc etc.

I'm so angry.

The delay is caused by the high buffer setting.

All DAWs will have throughput delay when you set the buffer high. Is that the question you're having? Or am I misunderstanding you?

Standard practice is to set the buffer as low as possible when you're using VI's (like Battery.)

[midnightrambler]

Originally Posted by Philthy

The delay is caused by the high buffer setting.

All DAWs will have throughput delay when you set the buffer high. Is that the question you're having? Or am I misunderstanding you?

Standard practice is to set the buffer as low as possible when you're using VI's (like Battery.)

It’s placing the MIDI early on the timeline. I’ll repeat, EARLY. Nothing to do with playability, which is fine, it’s to do with *where* the MIDI is placed on the timeline after recording. Why is it placed early? Does this not bother anyone else? Is there some weird quirk with my system, and my system alone, that means I can play the VI fine, with no playing latency at high buffer settings, but the MIDI is early?