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-   -   128GB vs 64GB memory (http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=404957)

tabonik 05-29-2019 04:07 AM

128GB vs 64GB memory
 
I have installed 128GB of internal memory in my 12-core Mac pro late 2013.
However, i am considering switching that to 64GB because of the clock speed difference of the memory.

128GB --> 1066 MHz DDR3
64GB --> 1866 MHz DDR3

As i understand, the computer will be significantly faster when the memory above 64GB is actually used, despite it being a slower clock speed.

But when i push it, the memory activity meter in PT only shows let's say 20% max.. Does that mean it is not using the extra memory at all?

My Q: What would be the advised memory to use?

musicman691 05-29-2019 05:24 AM

Re: 128GB vs 64GB memory
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tabonik (Post 2527645)
I have installed 128GB of internal memory in my 12-core Mac pro late 2013.
However, i am considering switching that to 64GB because of the clock speed difference of the memory.

128GB --> 1066 MHz DDR3
64GB --> 1866 MHz DDR3

As i understand, the computer will be significantly faster when the memory above 64GB is actually used, despite it being a slower clock speed.

But when i push it, the memory activity meter in PT only shows let's say 20% max.. Does that mean it is not using the extra memory at all?

My Q: What would be the advised memory to use?

I think your memory speed specs for the 128 gig are wrong, at least according to the OWC site. They show a speed of 1333 MHz for the 32GB modules and 1866 MHz for all their other ram. If you want max performance instead of filling all four memory slots just use the first three as MacPros use triple channel ram (or at least they used to). To save yourself some money just pull the ram module in slot 4 and leave yourself with 96 gig of ram. Ram bus speed for the trashcan is 1833 MHz.

I know some places like OWC will let you do a swap of memory modules buying back your old stuff but you'll never recoup all the money and end up paying more if you go for the smaller ram modules.

tabonik 05-29-2019 06:13 AM

Re: 128GB vs 64GB memory
 
The memory speed specs for the 128GB are correct: 1066MHz.

I just bought the system as configured and the seller offered me to swap the memory if i wanted. So it is not a matter of loosing coins. I am just looking for the most effective way of configuring it.

I guess the main question is; does PT use more than 64GB in extreme situations? Because if so, i guess i shouldn't change it.

As a side point i must say i had some instability issues causing the Mac to crash a lot. I thought this could be because of the 128GB which is not officially supported by Apple for this system. I tested the memory using the cards individually in each slot, but that seems ok. I did an smc reset. I think that helped a bit but it didn't heal the Mac completely. But suddenly in the last >week or so the Mac runs like a charm.. So i'm not sure why or how but it seems to be solved. Strange stuff yeah...

musicman691 05-29-2019 06:27 AM

Re: 128GB vs 64GB memory
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tabonik (Post 2527651)
The memory speed specs for the 128GB are correct: 1066MHz.

I just bought the system as configured and the seller offered me to swap the memory if i wanted. So it is not a matter of loosing coins. I am just looking for the most effective way of configuring it.

I guess the main question is; does PT use more than 64GB in extreme situations? Because if so, i guess i shouldn't change it.

As a side point i must say i had some instability issues causing the Mac to crash a lot. I thought this could be because of the 128GB which is not officially supported by Apple for this system. I tested the memory using the cards individually in each slot, but that seems ok. I did an smc reset. I think that helped a bit but it didn't heal the Mac completely. But suddenly in the last >week or so the Mac runs like a charm.. So i'm not sure why or how but it seems to be solved. Strange stuff yeah...

I still say that speed for the 128 gig is wrong. Who are you getting the computer from? And where is that person/business getting their ram from? I'm basing my words off of this page at OWC: https://eshop.macsales.com/item/OWC/1333D3Z3M128/

If you're getting crashes due to instability I don't think the ram itself is the culprit but that you have other issues. It could be the ram used isn't compatible with your Mac Pro. Testing individual ram modules on their own won't necessarily tell you anything. Plenty of people use more ram than what Apple says works and have no stability issues provided the ram is compatible with the Mac in question. Apple bases their ram specs on what is available at the time a particular model is released.

PT will use as much as ram as it needs to use and with 64 bit addressing it can address more ram than anyone can put in any current consumer (i.e. non-government) computer.

Get in touch with Darryll Ramm (he's a member here) as he might well be able to help you with some of the h/w debugging you're going to need to do.

BTW - what OSX are you running?

Southsidemusic 05-29-2019 06:30 AM

Re: 128GB vs 64GB memory
 
Jack, Just for non confusion the Ram bus speed for the trashcan is 1866 MHz Not 1833 MHz. I know that was a typo, just want this to be 100% clear ;)

tabonik 05-29-2019 07:07 AM

Re: 128GB vs 64GB memory
 
The link to the OWC memory kit is interesting. I'm getting my computer from a refurbished Mac reseller who sells a lot here in Holland. Not sure where they get the memory from.
But i found this article where they also talk about 1066MHz for the 128GB;
https://barefeats.com/tube15.html

"PT will use as much as ram as it needs to use and with 64 bit addressing it can address more ram than anyone can put in any current consumer (i.e. non-government) computer." - In that case the 128GB should be an improvement over the 64GB indeed. Thanks for confirming.

I'm running the latest OS Mojave version 10.14.5.

Thanks a lot for leading me to Darryll, i will contact him when needed. As said the computer runs without any issues at the moment.
I updated from High Sierra to Mojave a couple of days ago. It was already running well on High Sierra the days before updating, so i cannot say Mojave did the trick although it might be more stable as well.

tabonik 05-29-2019 07:54 AM

Re: 128GB vs 64GB memory
 
FYI- I contacted macsales about the OWC memory and they provide the following info;

"Due to processor design and memory architectures, 32GB module utilization occurs at a bus speed of 1066MHz with Apple Mac Pro 2013 E5-16XXv2 4-Core, 6-Core, and 8-Core processor equipped models, 800MHz with factory 12-Core or after-market E5-26XX equipped models. Utilization of 2 or more 32GB modules minimum is recommended and utilization of overall performance with applications and workflows able to utilize higher available memory remains exceptional.

To clarify, the bus speed of your memory at 128GB would be 800MHz. However, this should still perform well for you considering you'd have 128GB of memory in total."

musicman691 05-29-2019 08:42 AM

Re: 128GB vs 64GB memory
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Southsidemusic (Post 2527655)
Jack, Just for non confusion the Ram bus speed for the trashcan is 1866 MHz Not 1833 MHz. I know that was a typo, just want this to be 100% clear ;)

Thanks for the correction; got my figures crossed.

musicman691 05-29-2019 08:47 AM

Re: 128GB vs 64GB memory
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tabonik (Post 2527671)
FYI- I contacted macsales about the OWC memory and they provide the following info;

"Due to processor design and memory architectures, 32GB module utilization occurs at a bus speed of 1066MHz with Apple Mac Pro 2013 E5-16XXv2 4-Core, 6-Core, and 8-Core processor equipped models, 800MHz with factory 12-Core or after-market E5-26XX equipped models. Utilization of 2 or more 32GB modules minimum is recommended and utilization of overall performance with applications and workflows able to utilize higher available memory remains exceptional.

To clarify, the bus speed of your memory at 128GB would be 800MHz. However, this should still perform well for you considering you'd have 128GB of memory in total."

That's an interesting bit of news to say the least.

reichman 05-29-2019 08:55 AM

Re: 128GB vs 64GB memory
 
Pro Tools as an application will never use more than 64GB RAM for application operation. But it can use 64GB+ if you set your cache size in Playback Engine to utilize the RAM for audio storage. So unless the audio in your typical sessions exceeds about 32GB, you will see no benefit above 64GB total RAM in the machine.

I chose 64GB because I could just about get a half hour TV show, PT, SoundMiner, EuCon and Atmos Production Suite to fit into that nicely.


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