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-   -   pro tools hdx 3 and Space + other heavy plugins (http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=405067)

groovebrother 06-04-2019 02:12 AM

pro tools hdx 3 and Space + other heavy plugins
 
hi,

i am a big user of reverb instances as i don't really like to send differents instruments in the same reverb (sometimes 8 to 10 TL Space opened).

I am still running a tdm system with 6 accel cards.

i was wondering how many space (true stereo) can i open using hdx cards at 24/96khz and still having the possibility to add other heavy plugins ?

If i recieve tracks to mix i may also need to open the MDW EQ on many tracks wich is the only EQ i use to mix with the Puigtech EQP1A

i am also a big fan of parallel compression so i may need lots of Aux with the following compressors : impact, but also waves compressors like puigchild, api 2500, h-comp & v-comp.

this in order to be abble to make re recodings if needed with no latency or, mix a band in live situation up to 48 tracks.

All of this would require lots of dsp ressources.

Would a hdx 3 do or, should i consider having more than 3 hdx cards as i do not intend to use native plugins ?

JFreak 06-04-2019 02:19 AM

Re: pro tools hdx 3 and Space + other heavy plugins
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by groovebrother (Post 2528390)
i do not intend to use native plugins ?

Waves screwed you by not supporting AAX-DSP so either you need to go native or find replacements

groovebrother 06-04-2019 02:33 AM

Re: pro tools hdx 3 and Space + other heavy plugins
 
oh really ?
ok no problems i'll go for other valve compressors simulations then.

As i do not only mix in the box I may use in the processing real compressors like TLA100A, The Phoenix and Tubetech.

Still would you have an idea on how many cards do i need to be cool using dsp plugins the way i need with no latency ?

As you know accel cards do not let me open such as 8 TL Space so, i would like to have the possibility to use that number or mabe 10 with hdx cards

JFreak 06-04-2019 02:45 AM

Re: pro tools hdx 3 and Space + other heavy plugins
 
using DSP cards for reverbs is just stupid, IMO

groovebrother 06-04-2019 03:00 AM

Re: pro tools hdx 3 and Space + other heavy plugins
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JFreak (Post 2528395)
using DSP cards for reverbs is just stupid, IMO

would you be so kind to explain please ?
btw i do have enough money to buy me a 480 + M7 + PCM96 + M6000 + EMT 250

JFreak 06-04-2019 03:09 AM

Re: pro tools hdx 3 and Space + other heavy plugins
 
DSP chips are made for very low latency deterministic processing that require small amount of memory made available to the chips... such as eq and dynamics processing. reverbs on the other hand require large memory to process stuff.. so your DSP cards go to waste if you try to run something they are not designed to do such as reverbs.

CPU on the other hand is perfect for lush reverbs, because the host computer has much much more memory to offer. Not only are the DSP reverbs "crippled" compared to native reverbs, but also they don't take full advantage of the DSP chips processing power (because the memory available to a DSP chip is a limiting factor).

So at least try to run your reverbs natively and everything else on your DSP. All hardware reverb boxes have few ms latency so you shouldn't be afraid of that.

groovebrother 06-04-2019 03:23 AM

Re: pro tools hdx 3 and Space + other heavy plugins
 
Yeah i know and if you'd give me the choise i would without any hesitations choose the HW reverbs.

And yes i experienced reverb in native mode and that's okay.

But in the mean time i hardly imagine avid buiding dsp card wich wouldn't fit the use of reverbs... or have i missed something ?

Beside as i do use TL Space with accel cards AND in native mode i do not hear any crippled revebs at all - they sound amazing

JFreak 06-04-2019 03:34 AM

Re: pro tools hdx 3 and Space + other heavy plugins
 
TL Space TDM is the best DSP reverb ever made and I don't see that any HDX reverb will match that easily.

Let's start with Avid ReVibe which we know can have two instances per one Accel chip, but only one instance per HDX chip. While TDM version took exactly 50% of a chip, the HDX version takes 78% and cannot share the remaining 22% with other plugin types (because it already used all of the memory available to the chip). Also latency of TDM version was 2 samples but HDX latency is 31 samples. To add to the burden, the plug lost the bright GUI and the II version looks just plain unintuitive to me.

HDX has advantages over TDM, but running reverb isn't one of them.

groovebrother 06-04-2019 03:44 AM

Re: pro tools hdx 3 and Space + other heavy plugins
 
(absolutely nothing personnal)
but that sounds so wierd that TLSpace called now Space isn't as good as the TDM version.

I have been a million miles away from being "up to date" regarding computer evolution as well as Avid stuff since 2010.

As you know the TL Space in true stereo mode is taking 4 dsp chip on an accel card so, i was hoping ... what do i say ? ... i was so far from thinking Avid wouldn't have made a HDX version wich was as good and wouldn't let us open more than in TDM mode without any "sounding issues".

What you are telling me is such a disapointment.
And i do not like to fix something wich is already working perfectly

JFreak 06-04-2019 03:47 AM

Re: pro tools hdx 3 and Space + other heavy plugins
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by groovebrother (Post 2528402)
What you are telling me is such a disapointment

What I'm telling you is current computers are more than capable enough to run "enough" reverbs, which wasn't the case when HD cards were introduced two decades ago. So instead of clinging to the old, just start using reverbs natively (unless you run a decades old host computer)


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